Things NOT to do


Bill Long
 

Is this. This is an unresponsive pile of trash. While I know this isnt AP specific, I mostly talk to you all these days, and this change is NOT good for users. 



M Hambrick
 

Hi Bill

The image is either too fuzzy or my eyes are bad (or both), but I can't read it.

Mike


David Johnson
 

Yeah, I like the concept of standardizing the equipment names for searching in Astrobin, but the implementation of the migration software is pretty awful.  It you type in “Canon…”, for example, you have to wait about five minutes for the suggestions to populate.  I finally migrated all my equipment, but it took a lot longer than it should have.  I split it into a few sessions, because it was so frustrating.  Good news is that you only need to migrate once (I hope).

Once you migrate, when you upload an image, you no longer have the option of copying the equipment list from another image.  This was always useful.  However, it does give you suggestions from your recent choices, so it’s not too bad, but I wish he’d kept the copying feature.

I don’t participate in the Astrobin forum, but I bet he’s had a lot of complaints


Andrew Burwell
 

I spent some time migrating my equipment and it is slow. I wonder if this is because we have thousands of people in the system doing the same thing, and eventually this will not be so slow.

With adding equipment to an image it was much faster this morning. It also allows you to save the equipment set when assigning it to an image. Once it's saved you can select that set easily for the next image. So in all, just a new way of working, and I don't think it's as terrible as let on here. In the long run this will become a very valuable tool making it easier to search and find specific equipment.


David Johnson
 

The migration implementation is awful, but I agree that it is likely to be an improvement overall in the long run.  He could still allow each user to have an equipment list with links to the overall equipment list, but, right now, your individual equipment list disappears after migration.  I still would prefer to copy equipment lists from another image and then tweak the differences rather than maintaining a bunch of equipment sets, but I can live with it.  I definitely appreciate having Astrobin as a resource.


fernandorivera3
 

Same over here, this looks a little too out of focus to be able to read it 🤔

Fernando


Bill Long
 

Really painful and thrust upon you with no other recourse. I'm sure over time it'll get better but it's perplexing as a user. Why should using the site become harder and not easier?



From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of David Johnson <dajohns37@...>
Sent: Sunday, July 3, 2022 7:12 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Things NOT to do
 
The migration implementation is awful, but I agree that it is likely to be an improvement overall in the long run.  He could still allow each user to have an equipment list with links to the overall equipment list, but, right now, your individual equipment list disappears after migration.  I still would prefer to copy equipment lists from another image and then tweak the differences rather than maintaining a bunch of equipment sets, but I can live with it.  I definitely appreciate having Astrobin as a resource.


Roland Christen
 

Actually I tried to use it, but gave up after about 20 minutes trying to set up my equipment on this new page. So for images that I post, they will not have much info except the bare minimum which will be listed in the comments section.

Roland

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Long <bill@...>
To: AP-GTO Groups.io <ap-gto@groups.io>
Sent: Sun, Jul 3, 2022 3:18 am
Subject: [ap-gto] Things NOT to do

Is this. This is an unresponsive pile of trash. While I know this isnt AP specific, I mostly talk to you all these days, and this change is NOT good for users. 



--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


ap@CaptivePhotons.com
 

On Mon, Jul 4, 2022 at 12:00 PM, Roland Christen wrote:
Actually I tried to use it, but gave up after about 20 minutes trying to set up my equipment on this new page. So for images that I post, they will not have much info except the bare minimum which will be listed in the comments section.
I finished the migration.  Part of it was pretty bad, where I had done stuff like saying "Sony 400/2.8 + 1.4tc" and that now needed to be split into two pieces, where there was no good provision for that, but I got through it.  Another was a "Chroma LRGB" that I had used (as opposed to individually), I never did find where that was used, I ended up having to switch it to "Lum" and ignore it; I am pretty sure it was not on any image.

Had you completed the migration? 

Maybe it was because I'm so new and have so few images up. And limited equipment; I suspect Roland you have a bit more access to gear than I do.  :) 

The biggest problem I had is that it does not seem to have any concept of "my" equipment, only my recent equipment.  So when I went to post an image yesterday (after migration) and got to the part about adding filters, I had to re-discover all the filters inside the list from the manufacturer, despite using the same set (in different combination) in various images. I think it would be much more useful if the presented list (vs searchable list) were drawn from everything you have posted, or at least posted in the last year.  Or have a way you can flag "favorites" so they always show. 

It would appear the only technique to accelerate this is building a preset -- the problem with that is while an equipment preset for the optics and mount makes sense, I do not use the same filters each time, so that seemed awkward. 

But it wasn't THAT hard, I got past it.

But I suspect its limitations are because he seems to do this stuff without user feedback, since he does not ALLOW discussion of Astrobin on Astrobin. Software written in a vacuum is unlikely to be broadly well received.  To me his rules on that are just bizarre, I have many times had cases where I wanted to say "how do you do X" in their forums, but it is forbidden.  Like an inverse "Fight Club", you can talk about it all you want in public, but not inside Astrobin where all the knowledgeable people hang out.  And over my brief tenure there I have had quite a few mysteries, some I eventually figured out, some I just ignore because I can't ask. 

Imagine if AP said "Do not ask about AP mounts" in this forum.  :) 

Linwood


Geof Lewis
 

Hi all,
This is an interesting thread. I also had some difficulties with the migration tool, so raised a support ticket with Salvatore about it and he was very responsive, in fact we had several email exchanges about it over the past 2 days as I did find it very confusing. However, with his help I have been able to migrate most of my gear, including creating some new gear items and editing some for a more accurate description.
I did make a couple of suggestions, which Salvatore indicated he may include, e.g. I also appear to have used Chroma LRGB somewhere, but have no clue on which images, so am not able to migrate it. It would be good if there was some way to search for the offending images, as I won't just pick a random Chroma L as that would be equally inaccurate.
This is certainly a fairly tedious process, but IMHO the quality of names that different people h have used definitely needed to be cleaned up, so I'm happy to do my bit.
Regards,

Geof


From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of ap@... <ap@...>
Sent: 04 July 2022 17:27
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Things NOT to do
 
On Mon, Jul 4, 2022 at 12:00 PM, Roland Christen wrote:
Actually I tried to use it, but gave up after about 20 minutes trying to set up my equipment on this new page. So for images that I post, they will not have much info except the bare minimum which will be listed in the comments section.
I finished the migration.  Part of it was pretty bad, where I had done stuff like saying "Sony 400/2.8 + 1.4tc" and that now needed to be split into two pieces, where there was no good provision for that, but I got through it.  Another was a "Chroma LRGB" that I had used (as opposed to individually), I never did find where that was used, I ended up having to switch it to "Lum" and ignore it; I am pretty sure it was not on any image.

Had you completed the migration? 

Maybe it was because I'm so new and have so few images up. And limited equipment; I suspect Roland you have a bit more access to gear than I do.  :) 

The biggest problem I had is that it does not seem to have any concept of "my" equipment, only my recent equipment.  So when I went to post an image yesterday (after migration) and got to the part about adding filters, I had to re-discover all the filters inside the list from the manufacturer, despite using the same set (in different combination) in various images. I think it would be much more useful if the presented list (vs searchable list) were drawn from everything you have posted, or at least posted in the last year.  Or have a way you can flag "favorites" so they always show. 

It would appear the only technique to accelerate this is building a preset -- the problem with that is while an equipment preset for the optics and mount makes sense, I do not use the same filters each time, so that seemed awkward. 

But it wasn't THAT hard, I got past it.

But I suspect its limitations are because he seems to do this stuff without user feedback, since he does not ALLOW discussion of Astrobin on Astrobin. Software written in a vacuum is unlikely to be broadly well received.  To me his rules on that are just bizarre, I have many times had cases where I wanted to say "how do you do X" in their forums, but it is forbidden.  Like an inverse "Fight Club", you can talk about it all you want in public, but not inside Astrobin where all the knowledgeable people hang out.  And over my brief tenure there I have had quite a few mysteries, some I eventually figured out, some I just ignore because I can't ask. 

Imagine if AP said "Do not ask about AP mounts" in this forum.  :) 

Linwood


Roland Christen
 

I don't have time to fart around. I have mounts and scopes to build. Built two Mach2 mounts today and will have a couple of 130's started. Marj and I work on weekends and holidays, yes.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: ap@... <ap@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Mon, Jul 4, 2022 11:27 am
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Things NOT to do

On Mon, Jul 4, 2022 at 12:00 PM, Roland Christen wrote:
Actually I tried to use it, but gave up after about 20 minutes trying to set up my equipment on this new page. So for images that I post, they will not have much info except the bare minimum which will be listed in the comments section.
I finished the migration.  Part of it was pretty bad, where I had done stuff like saying "Sony 400/2.8 + 1.4tc" and that now needed to be split into two pieces, where there was no good provision for that, but I got through it.  Another was a "Chroma LRGB" that I had used (as opposed to individually), I never did find where that was used, I ended up having to switch it to "Lum" and ignore it; I am pretty sure it was not on any image.

Had you completed the migration? 

Maybe it was because I'm so new and have so few images up. And limited equipment; I suspect Roland you have a bit more access to gear than I do.  :) 

The biggest problem I had is that it does not seem to have any concept of "my" equipment, only my recent equipment.  So when I went to post an image yesterday (after migration) and got to the part about adding filters, I had to re-discover all the filters inside the list from the manufacturer, despite using the same set (in different combination) in various images. I think it would be much more useful if the presented list (vs searchable list) were drawn from everything you have posted, or at least posted in the last year.  Or have a way you can flag "favorites" so they always show. 

It would appear the only technique to accelerate this is building a preset -- the problem with that is while an equipment preset for the optics and mount makes sense, I do not use the same filters each time, so that seemed awkward. 

But it wasn't THAT hard, I got past it.

But I suspect its limitations are because he seems to do this stuff without user feedback, since he does not ALLOW discussion of Astrobin on Astrobin. Software written in a vacuum is unlikely to be broadly well received.  To me his rules on that are just bizarre, I have many times had cases where I wanted to say "how do you do X" in their forums, but it is forbidden.  Like an inverse "Fight Club", you can talk about it all you want in public, but not inside Astrobin where all the knowledgeable people hang out.  And over my brief tenure there I have had quite a few mysteries, some I eventually figured out, some I just ignore because I can't ask. 

Imagine if AP said "Do not ask about AP mounts" in this forum.  :) 

Linwood

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


ap@CaptivePhotons.com
 

On Mon, Jul 4, 2022 at 02:25 PM, Roland Christen wrote:
I don't have time to fart around. I have mounts and scopes to build.
I doubt anyone on this list will argue with your priorities there.  :) 

Linwood


Bill Long
 

It wants someone to migrate every piece a gear they have ever used. So for those that have some really old images (even those moved to staging) it is asking you to migrate tons of gear via a very slow and clunky interface.


From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...>
Sent: Monday, July 4, 2022 11:25 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Things NOT to do
 
I don't have time to fart around. I have mounts and scopes to build. Built two Mach2 mounts today and will have a couple of 130's started. Marj and I work on weekends and holidays, yes.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: ap@... <ap@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Mon, Jul 4, 2022 11:27 am
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Things NOT to do

On Mon, Jul 4, 2022 at 12:00 PM, Roland Christen wrote:
Actually I tried to use it, but gave up after about 20 minutes trying to set up my equipment on this new page. So for images that I post, they will not have much info except the bare minimum which will be listed in the comments section.
I finished the migration.  Part of it was pretty bad, where I had done stuff like saying "Sony 400/2.8 + 1.4tc" and that now needed to be split into two pieces, where there was no good provision for that, but I got through it.  Another was a "Chroma LRGB" that I had used (as opposed to individually), I never did find where that was used, I ended up having to switch it to "Lum" and ignore it; I am pretty sure it was not on any image.

Had you completed the migration? 

Maybe it was because I'm so new and have so few images up. And limited equipment; I suspect Roland you have a bit more access to gear than I do.  :) 

The biggest problem I had is that it does not seem to have any concept of "my" equipment, only my recent equipment.  So when I went to post an image yesterday (after migration) and got to the part about adding filters, I had to re-discover all the filters inside the list from the manufacturer, despite using the same set (in different combination) in various images. I think it would be much more useful if the presented list (vs searchable list) were drawn from everything you have posted, or at least posted in the last year.  Or have a way you can flag "favorites" so they always show. 

It would appear the only technique to accelerate this is building a preset -- the problem with that is while an equipment preset for the optics and mount makes sense, I do not use the same filters each time, so that seemed awkward. 

But it wasn't THAT hard, I got past it.

But I suspect its limitations are because he seems to do this stuff without user feedback, since he does not ALLOW discussion of Astrobin on Astrobin. Software written in a vacuum is unlikely to be broadly well received.  To me his rules on that are just bizarre, I have many times had cases where I wanted to say "how do you do X" in their forums, but it is forbidden.  Like an inverse "Fight Club", you can talk about it all you want in public, but not inside Astrobin where all the knowledgeable people hang out.  And over my brief tenure there I have had quite a few mysteries, some I eventually figured out, some I just ignore because I can't ask. 

Imagine if AP said "Do not ask about AP mounts" in this forum.  :) 

Linwood

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Chris White
 

On Mon, Jul 4, 2022 at 04:12 PM, Bill Long wrote:
It wants someone to migrate every piece a gear they have ever used. So for those that have some really old images (even those moved to staging) it is asking you to migrate tons of gear via a very slow and clunky interface.
So far I've been ignoring those emails.....

I'm also annoyed by the revision selection.  If you click on a revision it opens it up in a popup window.  I'm sure all these issues will sort out and in the long run it will be a better product, but for now I just hate it when places go and change things that are already working and make them worse.  Abin's equipment database has been very poor for so many years, that it takes a lot of fixing to sort it out as there are years of inputs that have been done in a poor way. 

Every time I go to buy a pair of shoes just like the pair I wore out they've been discontinued or changed and I have to start over to find a pair that makes my feet happy.  There should be a law against this... 


Andrew Burwell
 

Honestly, there is an easy solution for this. Most equipment listings are just variations of the same thing. He should have been able to mass migrate all the obvious stuff, and leave users to sort only the things that were less obvious. This would make it easier on everyone, and would get you a faster migration process.


Bill Long
 

Agreed. Placing the burden of solving the issue in terms of work, on users, is a bad thing.


From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Andrew Burwell via groups.io <andrew_burwell@...>
Sent: Monday, July 4, 2022 6:00 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Things NOT to do
 
Honestly, there is an easy solution for this. Most equipment listings are just variations of the same thing. He should have been able to mass migrate all the obvious stuff, and leave users to sort only the things that were less obvious. This would make it easier on everyone, and would get you a faster migration process.