Strange


alain.prette@...
 

Hi all

If you have any ideas ???  very strange

My setup AP155/ Mach2

Regards,

Alain


Linwood Ferguson
 

Are you asking about the satellite trail?  It looks like it moved across and while doing so you had a couple of guiding/tracking excursions that made in depart from a straight line. If you look at some moderately bright stars they seem to have some up/down elongation also probably from the same issue. 

Linwood


Roland Christen
 

What exactly is strange in this image? Can you explain further?

Rolando


-----Original Message-----
From: alain.prette@...
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Sun, Mar 26, 2023 5:31 am
Subject: [ap-gto] Strange

Hi all

If you have any ideas ???  very strange

My setup AP155/ Mach2

Regards,

Alain

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


alain.prette@...
 

Hi Rolando

I'm talking about the path of the satellite is not straight
Perhaps this is :
- Polaire setting default
- balancing ?

i'm going to try again .. Mach2 is very TOP =);

Best,

Alain


Roland Christen
 

Some satellites tumble. But no, I don't know what causes this satellite to not go straight. I don't think it means anything. The mount tracks stars. If you want to see how stars track, adjust the mount azimuth axis by moving it 10 - 15 degrees to the West (or East). Then take a 5 minute unguided exposure of the resultant star trail. You will then see the mount's tracking behavior recorded on your image. It's a classic test all of us old timers have known since film was invented.

Rolando


-----Original Message-----
From: alain.prette@...
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Sun, Mar 26, 2023 9:53 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Strange

Hi Rolando

I'm talking about the path of the satellite is not straight
Perhaps this is :
- Polaire setting default
- balancing ?

i'm going to try again .. Mach2 is very TOP =);

Best,

Alain

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Howard Ritter
 

Bonjour, Alain—

When I was young, I used to track satellites for the U.S. Air Force. I’m intrigued by why your satellite trail is so irregular. Even aside from my Air Force experience, I have seen a lot of satellite trails on astroimages. NONE of them looked like this. And in any case, when a satellite rotates or tumbles, its motion is periodic and smooth, and its brightness varies. Your trail’s side-to-side motion in is chaotic and rough, and its brightness is constant 

Also, the width of the largest oscillation is about 1/10 of its length, meaning that if the oscillation were due to motion of the satellite, the average velocity of the oscillation across the line of sight would have to have been 1/10 of the satellite’s orbital velocity. Since the part of the satellite reflecting sunlight would be in circular motion, its speed would have to be pi times that. Since low-Earth orbital speed is about 28,000 km/h, the point on the satellite that was reflecting the light your camera recorded as a trail would have to have been moving around the satellite’s center of mass at ~9000 km/h!  

We can safely say that the oscillations in the trail of your satellite were not due to its rotation. This leaves only motion of the telescope, a reflective component in the optical path, or the camera relative to the optical path.

Is it possible that your telescope was bumped or jostled during the exposure?


—howard



Quand j'étais jeune, je suivais les satellites pour l'armée de l'air américaine. Je suis intrigué par la raison pour laquelle la traînée de votre satellite est si irrégulière. En dehors de mon expérience dans l'armée de l'air, j'ai vu beaucoup de traînées de satellites sur des astroimages. AUCUNE d'entre elles ne ressemblait à celle-ci. Quoi qu'il en soit, lorsqu'un satellite tourne ou culbute, son mouvement est périodique et régulier, et sa luminosité varie. Le mouvement latéral de votre traînée est chaotique et irrégulier, et sa luminosité est constante 

En outre, la largeur de la plus grande oscillation est d'environ 1/10 de sa longueur, ce qui signifie que si l'oscillation était due au mouvement du satellite, la vitesse moyenne de l'oscillation sur la ligne de visée aurait dû être égale à 1/10 de la vitesse orbitale du satellite. Étant donné que la partie du satellite réfléchissant la lumière du soleil serait en mouvement circulaire, sa vitesse devrait être égale à pi fois cette vitesse. La vitesse de l'orbite terrestre basse étant d'environ 28 000 km/h, le point du satellite qui réfléchissait la lumière que votre caméra a enregistrée sous forme de traînée aurait dû se déplacer autour du centre de masse du satellite à ~9 000 km/h !  

Nous pouvons donc affirmer que les oscillations de la traînée de votre satellite ne sont pas dues à sa rotation. Il ne reste donc que le mouvement du télescope, d'un élément réfléchissant dans le chemin optique ou de la caméra par rapport au chemin optique.

Est-il possible que votre télescope ait été heurté ou bousculé pendant l'exposition ?


—howard

On Mar 27, 2023, at 4:31 AM, Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...> wrote:

Some satellites tumble. But no, I don't know what causes this satellite to not go straight. I don't think it means anything. The mount tracks stars. If you want to see how stars track, adjust the mount azimuth axis by moving it 10 - 15 degrees to the West (or East). Then take a 5 minute unguided exposure of the resultant star trail. You will then see the mount's tracking behavior recorded on your image. It's a classic test all of us old timers have known since film was invented.

Rolando


-----Original Message-----
From: alain.prette@...
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Sun, Mar 26, 2023 9:53 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Strange

Hi Rolando

I'm talking about the path of the satellite is not straight
Perhaps this is :
- Polaire setting default
- balancing ?

i'm going to try again .. Mach2 is very TOP =);

Best,

Alain

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


alain.prette@...
 

Hi Howard,

During this session , i did shoot of 300s ... windy .. perhaps an cat =); 🐱 


But the result is correct 


rockhead_20601
 

" If you want to see how stars track, adjust the mount azimuth axis by moving it 10 - 15 degrees to the West (or East)."

 That's the way I record star spectra with a prism in front of the objective.

Richard


 

Richard

>>> That's the way I record star spectra with a prism in front of the objective.

interesting! is that a sort of an "easy" slit spectroscopy?



On Mon, Mar 27, 2023 at 11:33 AM rockhead_20601 <richardoneill@...> wrote:
" If you want to see how stars track, adjust the mount azimuth axis by moving it 10 - 15 degrees to the West (or East)."

 That's the way I record star spectra with a prism in front of the objective.

Richard




rockhead_20601
 

Hello Brian,

  It is easy, no slit. Plus, the size of the prism determines the amount of light transmitted to the sensor. That experiment was conducted during my film days, a very long time ago in a place not all that far away. ;) What was interesting to me was that I could easily match the spectral lines with known elements. It was fun but I suspect there are much better methods in use these days.

Richard