Welcome Klaus! 

What camera are you using?  I had failed solves on my model with IMX455, and when I went to a 50% size frame the problem went away.

Or are you saying that those failed solves have bad captures with elongated stars?

As far as the dashed lines go, I get that if my mount hits a horizon limit.  Despite having APCC set to not track past a horizon limit, it will stop for the exposure that hits the limit and then continue tracking on the next exposure.  I wonder if there is a bug in APCC as I dont understand how my capture software can override the mount horizon limit.  I havent asked about it yet here as I just found the issue. 

Hi Klaus,

Would be happy to receive a description of how this is solvable.

If you are not running the latest Mach2 firmware (VCP5-P02-15), you should update it. If the firmware is up to date, or still haeve this problem after updating, contact Mike Hanson at Astro-Physics for further instructions.

-Ray

In your picture, which way is N-S and E-W? (RA direction?)

Roland

-----Original Message-----
From: Klaus Völler <Klaus.Voeller@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Sun, Nov 20, 2022 3:54 am
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] slew warning APPM with Mach2

Hi Chris,

thank you for your answer. I am using a QHY600M with 2x2 binning on a TEC140FL for "plate solving". The green dots have been solved successfully. In case of errors, the image does not really show elongated stars, but looks like star trails.... and as you can see from my attached images (first mail), the faulty points are all within the horizon boundary. Are not on the edge of the boundary but slightly offset inward and can be seen on both sides west/east. Both axes are in balance. All screws checked. Before I called APPM, I also did a polar alignment (deviation 6'').

This topic already existed in earlier postings and Rolando mentioned that the mount does not come to rest there, it pumps.... I already made a model half a year ago with the same equipment. No faulty points.  

Attached is an example picture from the camera where the plate solve failed.

regards Klaus

Am 20.11.22 um 02:25 schrieb Chris White:

Welcome Klaus! 

What camera are you using?  I had failed solves on my model with IMX455, and when I went to a 50% size frame the problem went away.

Or are you saying that those failed solves have bad captures with elongated stars?

As far as the dashed lines go, I get that if my mount hits a horizon limit.  Despite having APCC set to not track past a horizon limit, it will stop for the exposure that hits the limit and then continue tracking on the next exposure.  I wonder if there is a bug in APCC as I dont understand how my capture software can override the mount horizon limit.  I havent asked about it yet here as I just found the issue. 

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics

Your capture software is taking pictures while the mount is still slewing to the end point. You will have to set a longer settle time in that software so it takes pictures when the mount has stopped slewing and is beginning to track.

Slewing to a star occurs in several motions. First is a short acceleration mode where the axis goes from zero to 1800x. Then it slews at 1800x to a point where it begins a deceleration phase. At the end of deceleration there is a very short centering move which takes approximately 100 milliseconds. It begins to track immediately without delay.

If you have an eyepiece, look thru it and slew to a star. See how it gets there and starts tracking. Unless one of the pulleys on the motor shaft or on the worm shaft is loose, the tracking will begin right away with no delay after a slew and center move. The pulleys each have 2 set screws, and they must be tight. We have never experienced a Mach2 mount with loose pulleys, so it would be very unusual.

Until you look thru an eyepiece and verify that your mount starts tracking immediately at the end of a slew, you will never be confident in the performance of the mount.

Roland

-----Original Message-----
From: Klaus Völler <Klaus.Voeller@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Mon, Nov 21, 2022 5:13 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] slew warning APPM with Mach2

RA should be top-down or bottom up...  Each fail have the same startrail direction.. all other had round stars..

One more little thing... The "clutch knobs" of the RA axis are hand-tightened. When I move the counterweight shaft back and forth very slightly, I notice minimal play in the axis. I am not sure if this is important.

regards Klaus

Am 21.11.22 um 16:48 schrieb Roland Christen via groups.io:

In your picture, which way is N-S and E-W? (RA direction?)

Roland

-----Original Message-----
From: Klaus Völler <Klaus.Voeller@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Sun, Nov 20, 2022 3:54 am
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] slew warning APPM with Mach2

Hi Chris,

thank you for your answer. I am using a QHY600M with 2x2 binning on a TEC140FL for "plate solving". The green dots have been solved successfully. In case of errors, the image does not really show elongated stars, but looks like star trails.... and as you can see from my attached images (first mail), the faulty points are all within the horizon boundary. Are not on the edge of the boundary but slightly offset inward and can be seen on both sides west/east. Both axes are in balance. All screws checked. Before I called APPM, I also did a polar alignment (deviation 6'').

This topic already existed in earlier postings and Rolando mentioned that the mount does not come to rest there, it pumps.... I already made a model half a year ago with the same equipment. No faulty points.  

Attached is an example picture from the camera where the plate solve failed.

regards Klaus

Am 20.11.22 um 02:25 schrieb Chris White:

Welcome Klaus! 

What camera are you using?  I had failed solves on my model with IMX455, and when I went to a 50% size frame the problem went away.

Or are you saying that those failed solves have bad captures with elongated stars?

As far as the dashed lines go, I get that if my mount hits a horizon limit.  Despite having APCC set to not track past a horizon limit, it will stop for the exposure that hits the limit and then continue tracking on the next exposure.  I wonder if there is a bug in APCC as I dont understand how my capture software can override the mount horizon limit.  I havent asked about it yet here as I just found the issue. 

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics

Hi Klaus

Have you enabled "require high accuracy slews"? I found that helped me

also of course make sure you are on the latest firmware

On Mon, Nov 21, 2022 at 11:37 PM Klaus Völler <Klaus.Voeller@...> wrote:

Hello Roland,
many thanks for the description... when I first tried to create a model nine days ago, the settle time was set to 2 seconds. For my second try on 11/19, I then set this up to 6 seconds.  The difference were marginal... only 3 points more solved (from 86 Points where 60 good  and 27 bad in case of 6 sec settle time and 800x slew rate)

In my opinion 6 seconds are a long time but maybe i'm wrong.  I will have a next try thursday to friday if the weather forcast is correct.
The firmware is updated now (VCP5-P02-15).

Are there other things i can do?


Thanks and regards Klaus

Am 22.11.22 um 00:37 schrieb Roland Christen via groups.io:

Your capture software is taking pictures while the mount is still slewing to the end point. You will have to set a longer settle time in that software so it takes pictures when the mount has stopped slewing and is beginning to track.

Slewing to a star occurs in several motions. First is a short acceleration mode where the axis goes from zero to 1800x. Then it slews at 1800x to a point where it begins a deceleration phase. At the end of deceleration there is a very short centering move which takes approximately 100 milliseconds. It begins to track immediately without delay.

If you have an eyepiece, look thru it and slew to a star. See how it gets there and starts tracking. Unless one of the pulleys on the motor shaft or on the worm shaft is loose, the tracking will begin right away with no delay after a slew and center move. The pulleys each have 2 set screws, and they must be tight. We have never experienced a Mach2 mount with loose pulleys, so it would be very unusual.

Until you look thru an eyepiece and verify that your mount starts tracking immediately at the end of a slew, you will never be confident in the performance of the mount.

Roland

-----Original Message-----
From: Klaus Völler <Klaus.Voeller@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Mon, Nov 21, 2022 5:13 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] slew warning APPM with Mach2

RA should be top-down or bottom up...  Each fail have the same startrail direction.. all other had round stars..

One more little thing... The "clutch knobs" of the RA axis are hand-tightened. When I move the counterweight shaft back and forth very slightly, I notice minimal play in the axis. I am not sure if this is important.

regards Klaus

Am 21.11.22 um 16:48 schrieb Roland Christen via groups.io:

In your picture, which way is N-S and E-W? (RA direction?)

Roland

-----Original Message-----
From: Klaus Völler <Klaus.Voeller@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Sun, Nov 20, 2022 3:54 am
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] slew warning APPM with Mach2

Hi Chris,

thank you for your answer. I am using a QHY600M with 2x2 binning on a TEC140FL for "plate solving". The green dots have been solved successfully. In case of errors, the image does not really show elongated stars, but looks like star trails.... and as you can see from my attached images (first mail), the faulty points are all within the horizon boundary. Are not on the edge of the boundary but slightly offset inward and can be seen on both sides west/east. Both axes are in balance. All screws checked. Before I called APPM, I also did a polar alignment (deviation 6'').

This topic already existed in earlier postings and Rolando mentioned that the mount does not come to rest there, it pumps.... I already made a model half a year ago with the same equipment. No faulty points.  

Attached is an example picture from the camera where the plate solve failed.

regards Klaus

Am 20.11.22 um 02:25 schrieb Chris White:

Welcome Klaus! 

What camera are you using?  I had failed solves on my model with IMX455, and when I went to a 50% size frame the problem went away.

Or are you saying that those failed solves have bad captures with elongated stars?

As far as the dashed lines go, I get that if my mount hits a horizon limit.  Despite having APCC set to not track past a horizon limit, it will stop for the exposure that hits the limit and then continue tracking on the next exposure.  I wonder if there is a bug in APCC as I dont understand how my capture software can override the mount horizon limit.  I havent asked about it yet here as I just found the issue. 

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics

--

Brian 

Brian Valente

astro portfolio https://www.brianvalentephotography.com/astrophotography/

portfolio brianvalentephotography.com 

astrobin https://www.astrobin.com/users/bvalente/

Looking at your plate solve I wonder if you have the same issue that I experienced with my Mach2.  It was due to encoder settings needing more dampening as sometimes after completion of a goto it would judder back and forth.  Here is an example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kTmXjHhtVk
Astro-Physics assisted me in configuring more encoder dampening. 

On Tue, Nov 22, 2022 at 11:02 AM, Klaus Völler wrote:

yes i saw your topic...Was this the case with your mount from the beginning? 

I think it was probably from the beginning but did not really notice it until one time when I did not have the mount well balanced which exacerbated the issue.  On further investigation, I found that sometimes despite elongated/streaked stars it plate-solved anyway - although I'm sure with not the same accuracy.  I was not getting the results that I hoped for using models and tracking unguided.  All is great now after resolving the judder. 

Are there other things i can do?

Look thru the scope, slew to a star and see what happens at the end of the slew. Use an eyepiece!

Rolando