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Old mach1 stiff axis
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I have just purchased a first generation mach 1. It's in beautiful condition and I'm looking forward to getting it out under the stars!
With the clutch knobs loose, both axis are very stiff. Using a fish scale it takes over 5 pounds of pull to move the axis without any load or weights on. Wondering if there is a service I can perform to help loosen these up a little. The mount has seen very little use over the years and none recently. Both axis were initially stuck, I suspect from just sitting idle. Thanks! |
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Woody Schlom
Chris, I also have an old Mach1. And yes, both axis get stiff. This doesn't alter the mount"s tracking performance as when tracking, the mount uses its high-quality roller bearings - not the more crude clutch bearings. And yes you can partially disassemble both axis and clean and regrease the clutches. They're simple surface bearings. I'd clean any and all old dirty grease off, and then regrease with a synthetic or Silicone grease. I used a TriFlo synthetic grease as I recall. It dramatically made balancing easier. But only for a year or so. Next time I'll probably try a 100% Silicone grease - such as you find at plumbing supply places. I think 100% Silicone grease is softer - lighter. But it's also all weather and doesn't thicken in the cold or drip in the summer. This is an easy project. Woody On November 20, 2022 5:17:41 PM "Chris White" <chris.white@...> wrote:
I have just purchased a first generation mach 1. It's in beautiful condition and I'm looking forward to getting it out under the stars! |
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On Sun, Nov 20, 2022 at 09:13 PM, Woody Schlom wrote:
That's good to hear woody! My main interest is for easier balancing. I'm hoping to go unguided and want to stack the deck in my favor. I have a tube of the AP special blend from when I did a service on another old AP mount. Could I use this on the clutches? As far as tracking, I have not tested yet but it sounds wonderful when slewing. |
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Woody Schlom
Chris, I've never seen or used AP's special gear grease so I can't compare. But I suspect 100% Silicone grease is softer (lighter). But I'm sure AP's worm gear grease would work. I've found the fish scale method works just fine for me. I've also used the power current method with an inline Powerwerks volt/amp meter but prefer the fish scale. Woody
On November 20, 2022 7:22:03 PM "Chris White" <chris.white@...> wrote:
On Sun, Nov 20, 2022 at 09:13 PM, Woody Schlom wrote: |
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Roland Christen
The axis is not stiff. It's the clutch that's stiff. A clutch is a device which allows you to decouple the scope from the gear wheels without lifting the worms out of mesh.The clutch has some grease on it, but if it gets old it may dry out and become stiff. You can take it apart quite easily if you are mechanically inclined, and clean out the old grease and apply some light lithium grease in its place. If you have questions, contact Dave here at AP and he can help you.
Roland
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris White <chris.white@...> To: main@ap-gto.groups.io Sent: Sun, Nov 20, 2022 7:17 pm Subject: [ap-gto] Old mach1 stiff axis I have just purchased a first generation mach 1. It's in beautiful condition and I'm looking forward to getting it out under the stars!
With the clutch knobs loose, both axis are very stiff. Using a fish scale it takes over 5 pounds of pull to move the axis without any load or weights on. Wondering if there is a service I can perform to help loosen these up a little. The mount has seen very little use over the years and none recently. Both axis were initially stuck, I suspect from just sitting idle. Thanks! -- Roland Christen Astro-Physics |
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Thanks Roland! I'm guessing this mount has the original 2006 grease. I'm going to do the gears today and I'll clean up the clutches. Can I use the AP gear grease on the clutches or is that not recommended?
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Roland Christen
Use something lighter. Clutches do not need heavy gear grease.
Roland
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris White <chris.white@...> To: main@ap-gto.groups.io Sent: Mon, Nov 21, 2022 12:27 pm Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Old mach1 stiff axis Thanks Roland! I'm guessing this mount has the original 2006 grease. I'm going to do the gears today and I'll clean up the clutches. Can I use the AP gear grease on the clutches or is that not recommended?
-- Roland Christen Astro-Physics |
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Ok!
Got the clutch apart. The grease was dried out. That explains things. Quick question. I only want to apply grease to the bare stainless surface of the surface bearing part of the main gear, correct? Or do I also want to apply it to the black anodized surface where the clutch knobs tighten into?   |
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Woody Schlom
Chris,
I believe you only apply grease to the silver parts. If you apply grease to the black part where the clutch drags make contact, I don’t think you’ll be able to get enough friction from the drags. But it’s been years since I’ve done this.
Woody
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris White
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2022 1:52 PM To: main@ap-gto.groups.io Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Old mach1 stiff axis
Ok! |
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On Mon, Nov 21, 2022 at 04:58 PM, Woody Schlom wrote:
That's what I was thinking but when I took it apart grease had clearly migrated all over the place. So I wasn't sure if that was intentional or not. |
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By the way Woody, I had a high end Silicone grease on hand. I'll let you know how it goes.
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Woody Schlom
Chris,
Well, maybe you need to wait for Roland to chime in. But I don’t see the need for grease on the friction parts of the clutch – only the bearing surfaces. And I even think grease on the friction parts would nullify the clutch function.
Woody
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris White
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2022 2:00 PM To: main@ap-gto.groups.io Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Old mach1 stiff axis
On Mon, Nov 21, 2022 at 04:58 PM, Woody Schlom wrote:
That's what I was thinking but when I took it apart grease had clearly migrated all over the place. So I wasn't sure if that was intentional or not. |
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Woody Schlom
Chris,
Thanks. One of these days (when I start using my Mach1 again) I’ll need to do this same procedure again.
Woody
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris White
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2022 2:01 PM To: main@ap-gto.groups.io Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Old mach1 stiff axis
By the way Woody, I had a high end Silicone grease on hand. I'll let you know how it goes. |
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George
Chris,
Apply grease to both sides of the brass ring (be careful to center it when reassembly). Also apply grease to the tapered section of the clutch plate (the black surface that the three clutch pads press against).
Regards,
George
George Whitney Astro-Physics, Inc. Phone: 815-222-6538 (direct line) Phone: 815-282-1513 (office) Email: george@... Video Tutorials: https://www.youtube.com/astrophysicscorp
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
On Behalf Of Woody Schlom
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2022 4:05 PM To: main@ap-gto.groups.io Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Old mach1 stiff axis
Chris,
Thanks. One of these days (when I start using my Mach1 again) I’ll need to do this same procedure again.
Woody
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
On Behalf Of Chris White
By the way Woody, I had a high end Silicone grease on hand. I'll let you know how it goes. |
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On Mon, Nov 21, 2022 at 05:32 PM, George wrote:
Excellent. Thank you George So, the silicone grease I had was no good for this purpose. It was too sticky and I could feel parts sticking before I even got things all the way back together. Trying to rotate with the clutch disengaged was no good. I cleaned it all off... Tomorrow I'll stop by the hardware store and get some White Lithium Grease unless told otherwise.... Thanks everyone who helped! |
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Roland Christen
The clutch should move freely with the adjustment knobs fully backed off. If you can't get it to work properly, call Dave here at AP and he will help you make any adjustments.
Roland
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris White <chris.white@...> To: main@ap-gto.groups.io Sent: Mon, Nov 21, 2022 5:19 pm Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Old mach1 stiff axis On Mon, Nov 21, 2022 at 05:32 PM, George wrote:
Excellent. Thank you George So, the silicone grease I had was no good for this purpose. It was too sticky and I could feel parts sticking before I even got things all the way back together. Trying to rotate with the clutch disengaged was no good. I cleaned it all off... Tomorrow I'll stop by the hardware store and get some White Lithium Grease unless told otherwise.... Thanks everyone who helped! -- Roland Christen Astro-Physics |
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>>>Tomorrow I'll stop by the hardware store and get some White Lithium Grease unless told otherwise.... Chris I can't speak for AP mounts, but lithium grease is a big "no" for Losmandy mounts. It ends up caking up over time and causes big headaches. I've seen pictures of aged lithium grease on mounts that I can't unsee I suspect a teflon-based one is better, but maybe check with AP for the official answer On Mon, Nov 21, 2022 at 3:19 PM Chris White <chris.white@...> wrote: On Mon, Nov 21, 2022 at 05:32 PM, George wrote: --
Brian Brian Valente astro portfolio https://www.brianvalentephotography.com/astrophotography/ portfolio brianvalentephotography.com |
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On Mon, Nov 21, 2022 at 06:49 PM, Brian Valente wrote:
Brian, Roland said Lithium Grease below in this thread. This is just for the clutch, not the gears... Roland, I dont think its an adjustment thing, I just need the right grease. Will White Lithium from Lowes work? Or do you have a specific recommendation? Thanks, -Chris |
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ah great thanks for the clarification On Mon, Nov 21, 2022 at 4:02 PM Chris White <chris.white@...> wrote: On Mon, Nov 21, 2022 at 06:49 PM, Brian Valente wrote: --
Brian Brian Valente astro portfolio https://www.brianvalentephotography.com/astrophotography/ portfolio brianvalentephotography.com |
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I also have Aeroshell 33 on hand.
This is NOT the MS version. |
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