Mobile Mounts


Bill Long
 

This is a guide graph, at 1 second intervals, from a AP mount (Ap400GTO) made about 20+ years ago. 

I dont know what yall are trying to do, but you have lost your way if you think these new mounts, can beat this old soul. 



Chris White
 

Well, thats pretty sweet.  I need to test my 400 out after it's service trip to AP!  I've been procrastinating due to weather and work, but this gives me some extra incentive.  Very nice performance!  And this was with the 130GTX on board correct?


Bill Long
 

Correct. It was a smashing success.



From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Chris White <chris.white@...>
Sent: Friday, September 30, 2022 6:10 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts
 
Well, thats pretty sweet.  I need to test my 400 out after it's service trip to AP!  I've been procrastinating due to weather and work, but this gives me some extra incentive.  Very nice performance!  And this was with the 130GTX on board correct?


Roland Christen
 

Now look what you've done. You're going to cause a run on these old mounts.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Long <bill@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Sent: Fri, Sep 30, 2022 2:49 am
Subject: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts

This is a guide graph, at 1 second intervals, from a AP mount (Ap400GTO) made about 20+ years ago. 

I dont know what yall are trying to do, but you have lost your way if you think these new mounts, can beat this old soul. 



--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Arvind
 

The only problem is what you have already mentioned -- it's no longer being made. If AP starts making small mounts that work for portable/easy-to-use setups, I'd like to be on the line to get one. As good as these mounts are, obtaining one is hard.. and then one needs to put the effort to bring it back to life (which, as we can see here is worth the effort if one can get it).

Right now, no one makes a premium portable mount. In addition to tracking accuracy, the premium mounts are also nice to use overall. The closest one is Rainbow, but like I always say, it is convenient but is not truly premium (especially the 135 version. The 300 is much nicer).



On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 9:07 AM Bill Long <bill@...> wrote:
Correct. It was a smashing success.



From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Chris White <chris.white@...>
Sent: Friday, September 30, 2022 6:10 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts
 
Well, thats pretty sweet.  I need to test my 400 out after it's service trip to AP!  I've been procrastinating due to weather and work, but this gives me some extra incentive.  Very nice performance!  And this was with the 130GTX on board correct?


Scott Cooke
 

Bill,
Very impressive.  This is way better than I was ever able to coax out of this mount.  I do not have the expertise you do and it goes to show you that you have to have the right tool for the job but nothing beats experience.  Bravo.
Thanks,
Scott

On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 3:49 AM Bill Long <bill@...> wrote:
This is a guide graph, at 1 second intervals, from a AP mount (Ap400GTO) made about 20+ years ago. 

I dont know what yall are trying to do, but you have lost your way if you think these new mounts, can beat this old soul. 



Bill Long
 

Wanted ads will appear everywhere now. 😃



From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...>
Sent: Friday, September 30, 2022 9:36 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts
 
Now look what you've done. You're going to cause a run on these old mounts.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Long <bill@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Sent: Fri, Sep 30, 2022 2:49 am
Subject: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts

This is a guide graph, at 1 second intervals, from a AP mount (Ap400GTO) made about 20+ years ago. 

I dont know what yall are trying to do, but you have lost your way if you think these new mounts, can beat this old soul. 



--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Bill Long
 

It was a cheeky comment that wasn't intended to be serious. I was impressed by the 400 GTO though. 



From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Arvind <base16@...>
Sent: Friday, September 30, 2022 9:49 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts
 
The only problem is what you have already mentioned -- it's no longer being made. If AP starts making small mounts that work for portable/easy-to-use setups, I'd like to be on the line to get one. As good as these mounts are, obtaining one is hard.. and then one needs to put the effort to bring it back to life (which, as we can see here is worth the effort if one can get it).

Right now, no one makes a premium portable mount. In addition to tracking accuracy, the premium mounts are also nice to use overall. The closest one is Rainbow, but like I always say, it is convenient but is not truly premium (especially the 135 version. The 300 is much nicer).



On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 9:07 AM Bill Long <bill@...> wrote:

Correct. It was a smashing success.



From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Chris White <chris.white@...>
Sent: Friday, September 30, 2022 6:10 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts
 
Well, thats pretty sweet.  I need to test my 400 out after it's service trip to AP!  I've been procrastinating due to weather and work, but this gives me some extra incentive.  Very nice performance!  And this was with the 130GTX on board correct?


Clement Elechi
 

Would a Takahashi EM11 be an option?

Clem

============================

My flickr gallery:


On Friday, September 30, 2022, 12:49:44 PM EDT, Arvind <base16@...> wrote


Right now, no one makes a premium portable mount. In addition to tracking accuracy, the premium mounts are also nice to use overall. The closest one is Rainbow, but like I always say, it is convenient but is not truly premium (especially the 135 version. The 300 is much nicer).



On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 9:07 AM Bill Long <bill@...> wrote:
Correct. It was a smashing success.



From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Chris White <chris.white@...>
Sent: Friday, September 30, 2022 6:10 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts
 
Well, thats pretty sweet.  I need to test my 400 out after it's service trip to AP!  I've been procrastinating due to weather and work, but this gives me some extra incentive.  Very nice performance!  And this was with the 130GTX on board correct?


Bill Long
 

I think those were quite popular before the strain wave craze hit  



From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Clement Elechi <celechi@...>
Sent: Friday, September 30, 2022 10:24 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts
 
Would a Takahashi EM11 be an option?

Clem

============================

My flickr gallery:


On Friday, September 30, 2022, 12:49:44 PM EDT, Arvind <base16@...> wrote


Right now, no one makes a premium portable mount. In addition to tracking accuracy, the premium mounts are also nice to use overall. The closest one is Rainbow, but like I always say, it is convenient but is not truly premium (especially the 135 version. The 300 is much nicer).



On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 9:07 AM Bill Long <bill@...> wrote:

Correct. It was a smashing success.



From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Chris White <chris.white@...>
Sent: Friday, September 30, 2022 6:10 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts
 
Well, thats pretty sweet.  I need to test my 400 out after it's service trip to AP!  I've been procrastinating due to weather and work, but this gives me some extra incentive.  Very nice performance!  And this was with the 130GTX on board correct?


Chris White
 

I dont mean to diminish bills result, but the 400gto is a very simple design and very user serviceable. Performing a grease and mesh is an easy task. I had to send mine back because the end play washer was stuck and then Dave told me that I didn't loosen the grub screws in it.... doh!  

But as far as tinkering goes, Bill didn't have to do any wizardry stuff.  

These 400gto come up often on the classifieds and if you upgrade to cp3 you can also use apcc pro with them. 


Bill Long
 

Some grease, mesh work, CP3, PEMPro curve, and a APCC tracking model were in play for this result. It turned out to be too good though since the clouds decided to come have a look shortly after I posted this. 😠



From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Scott Cooke <TSCOOKE64@...>
Sent: Friday, September 30, 2022 9:52 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts
 
Bill,
Very impressive.  This is way better than I was ever able to coax out of this mount.  I do not have the expertise you do and it goes to show you that you have to have the right tool for the job but nothing beats experience.  Bravo.
Thanks,
Scott

On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 3:49 AM Bill Long <bill@...> wrote:

This is a guide graph, at 1 second intervals, from a AP mount (Ap400GTO) made about 20+ years ago. 

I dont know what yall are trying to do, but you have lost your way if you think these new mounts, can beat this old soul. 



Andrea Lucchetti
 

A big run please :-)
I think a lot of AP owners may add  a smaller 400 for lens work, comet photography, travel.
Andrea

Il giorno ven 30 set 2022 alle 18:36 Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> ha scritto:
Now look what you've done. You're going to cause a run on these old mounts.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Long <bill@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Sent: Fri, Sep 30, 2022 2:49 am
Subject: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts

This is a guide graph, at 1 second intervals, from a AP mount (Ap400GTO) made about 20+ years ago. 

I dont know what yall are trying to do, but you have lost your way if you think these new mounts, can beat this old soul. 



--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Andrea Lucchetti
 

Not an option in Europe right now: their electronics is not certified and are not imported for the time being

Il giorno ven 30 set 2022 alle 19:31 Bill Long <bill@...> ha scritto:
I think those were quite popular before the strain wave craze hit  



From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Clement Elechi <celechi@...>
Sent: Friday, September 30, 2022 10:24 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts
 
Would a Takahashi EM11 be an option?

Clem

============================

My flickr gallery:


On Friday, September 30, 2022, 12:49:44 PM EDT, Arvind <base16@...> wrote


Right now, no one makes a premium portable mount. In addition to tracking accuracy, the premium mounts are also nice to use overall. The closest one is Rainbow, but like I always say, it is convenient but is not truly premium (especially the 135 version. The 300 is much nicer).



On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 9:07 AM Bill Long <bill@...> wrote:
Correct. It was a smashing success.



From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Chris White <chris.white@...>
Sent: Friday, September 30, 2022 6:10 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts
 
Well, thats pretty sweet.  I need to test my 400 out after it's service trip to AP!  I've been procrastinating due to weather and work, but this gives me some extra incentive.  Very nice performance!  And this was with the 130GTX on board correct?


Bill Long
 

The instructions on the AP site were very easy to follow to take the mount apart and clean and grease it up. The worm wheels I cleaned the gunk from with some simple green and a toothbrush. They looked brand new after. Adjusting the mesh was the same simple task by following the instructions. Here I made very small changes until I couldn't hear any laboring sounds and no motor stalls occurred.

The rest was all software magic.

I did replace the altitude locking bolt with the handle version from the Mach 1. That was a nice upgrade. If others go this route, when you upgrade to CP3 you'll need to contact AP to set the CP3 properly for the 400. Howard sent me a script that worked perfectly.

Bill


From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Chris White <chris.white@...>
Sent: Friday, September 30, 2022 10:33 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts
 
I dont mean to diminish bills result, but the 400gto is a very simple design and very user serviceable. Performing a grease and mesh is an easy task. I had to send mine back because the end play washer was stuck and then Dave told me that I didn't loosen the grub screws in it.... doh!  

But as far as tinkering goes, Bill didn't have to do any wizardry stuff.  

These 400gto come up often on the classifieds and if you upgrade to cp3 you can also use apcc pro with them. 


Bill Long
 

The only thing I would change would be to move the motor cables similar to the Mach 2 design, and run the same USB and 12V Power Pole connection through it. Perfectly good otherwise. 



From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@...>
Sent: Friday, September 30, 2022 10:38 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts
 
A big run please :-)
I think a lot of AP owners may add  a smaller 400 for lens work, comet photography, travel.
Andrea

Il giorno ven 30 set 2022 alle 18:36 Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> ha scritto:

Now look what you've done. You're going to cause a run on these old mounts.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Long <bill@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Sent: Fri, Sep 30, 2022 2:49 am
Subject: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts

This is a guide graph, at 1 second intervals, from a AP mount (Ap400GTO) made about 20+ years ago. 

I dont know what yall are trying to do, but you have lost your way if you think these new mounts, can beat this old soul. 



--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Ram
 

Given how much mach1 and older mounts are in demand on Astromart, I believe there is a big market for  simpler, high quality mounts smaller mounts. 
Not everyone has an observatory where they can polar align once and use mount models and not guide. With increasing light pollution, the only opportunity people have for imaging is on a trip to a dark site.
Guiding is almost mandatory in those situations. No need for high precision, absolute encoders. But quality is not negotiable. 
I really hope a mach1 or smaller mount would come back.



Bill Long
 

The 400 measured about 12" PE before PEMPro and 1" after. I don't have any illusions of unguided imaging with this, but it takes to guiding quite well.



From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Ram <ramviswanathan@...>
Sent: Friday, September 30, 2022 11:04 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mobile Mounts
 
Given how much mach1 and older mounts are in demand on Astromart, I believe there is a big market for  simpler, high quality mounts smaller mounts. 
Not everyone has an observatory where they can polar align once and use mount models and not guide. With increasing light pollution, the only opportunity people have for imaging is on a trip to a dark site.
Guiding is almost mandatory in those situations. No need for high precision, absolute encoders. But quality is not negotiable. 
I really hope a mach1 or smaller mount would come back.



Chris White
 

On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 02:04 PM, Ram wrote:
I really hope a mach1 or smaller mount would come back.
The mach2 is similar size to the mach1. Granted, the encoders add expense. 

Now that I've used encoders I'd not buy a new mount without them. Even a little 400mount with AE would be a tremendous mount.  The mach2 punches way above its weight and I have no doubt a small light 400AE would do the same. 

I'm not saying that you are, but a lot of people underestimate just how nice it is to go unguided.  Adding guiding into the process is a big time expense and with so few clear nights I try to get every minute on target I can. 


Ram
 

Mach2 weight -- 42 lbs
Mach1 weight - 33 lbs
AP1100 weight -- 43.2 -- without dec top plate.
Mach2 is closer in weight to AP1100. But the 1100 comes apart and is therefore easier to transport and use in the field. 

For my nomadic needs, 1100 or a mach1/smaller mount are more suitable.