Disaster strikes with my AP1100!


Tom Blahovici
 

Wow, no idea what happened...

I've had my Ap1100 for about 2 months now.  I was imaging tonight and everything was great.  I did about 3 hours, tracking was 0.31 arcsec RMS.

All of a sudden the guide starts were lost. I restarted my sequence (I use Voyager) and the mount would slew but plate solves were failing.  I did a park 3 and noticed that the position is off. I then closed down everything, loosened the clutches and reset everything to the right position. Next I  powered down and restarted the PC.  I started APCC, did an initialize and then noticed that the mount started moving on it's own.  It kept moving and by the time I powered it down it crashed into the pier and ripped out the camera connector.
It went counterweight up and 90 degrees in Dec.

What in the world happened? And how can I recover and have faith in the mount???
Tom


Bill Long
 

You should upload the AP V2 ASCOM and APCC logs.


From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Tom Blahovici <tom.va2fsq@...>
Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2021 9:51 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: [ap-gto] Disaster strikes with my AP1100!
 

Wow, no idea what happened...

I've had my Ap1100 for about 2 months now.  I was imaging tonight and everything was great.  I did about 3 hours, tracking was 0.31 arcsec RMS.

All of a sudden the guide starts were lost. I restarted my sequence (I use Voyager) and the mount would slew but plate solves were failing.  I did a park 3 and noticed that the position is off. I then closed down everything, loosened the clutches and reset everything to the right position. Next I  powered down and restarted the PC.  I started APCC, did an initialize and then noticed that the mount started moving on it's own.  It kept moving and by the time I powered it down it crashed into the pier and ripped out the camera connector.
It went counterweight up and 90 degrees in Dec.

What in the world happened? And how can I recover and have faith in the mount???
Tom


Tom Blahovici
 

Will do in the morning.
One thing that I did do while the Voyager sequence was running is I created a new sequence to use later on in the evening. Most likely this did something to the running sequence which threw the mount off and caused the running sequence to fail.
The question is how to recover now?
I think I should begin by placing the mount in the park 3 position, start up apcc, then do a resume from park 3. Is this correct?


Christopher Erickson
 

How fast was the slew?

In cases like this, the likely culprits are, in my experience:

1. Software-related issue. Could be a crashed program or module. Or a miscinfiguration. Or a combination of an unusual configuration with an unusual operation or position. Possibly a control conflict between several programs or with the hand controller with something accidentally pressing the wrong button on the controller.

2. Cable connector-related issue. Like a loose motor cable connector or damaged motor cable. A damaged or improperly crimped autoguider cable connector, resulting in a short between certain pins. A loose or oxidized USB cable connector. A loose or damaged RS-232 cable.

3. ESD - ElectroStatic Discharge. Static electricity could have disrupted or damaged your electronic devices someplace. The CP2/3/4/5's are hardened a fair amount against ESD damage but they aren't indestructible. The encoders on the motors are well-protected, as long as they are solidly connected to the CP2/3/4/5 servo controllers. Devices that are significantly more vulnerable to ESD are cameras, guide cameras, computers and anything with a USB or Ethernet port on it. Ethernet can take a bit more abuse than USB, but isn't indestructible either.

I hope this helps.


-Christopher Erickson
Observatory engineer
Waikoloa, HI 96738
www.summitkinetics.com
   

On Tue, Dec 14, 2021, 10:00 PM Bill Long <bill@...> wrote:
You should upload the AP V2 ASCOM and APCC logs.


From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Tom Blahovici <tom.va2fsq@...>
Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2021 9:51 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: [ap-gto] Disaster strikes with my AP1100!
 

Wow, no idea what happened...

I've had my Ap1100 for about 2 months now.  I was imaging tonight and everything was great.  I did about 3 hours, tracking was 0.31 arcsec RMS.

All of a sudden the guide starts were lost. I restarted my sequence (I use Voyager) and the mount would slew but plate solves were failing.  I did a park 3 and noticed that the position is off. I then closed down everything, loosened the clutches and reset everything to the right position. Next I  powered down and restarted the PC.  I started APCC, did an initialize and then noticed that the mount started moving on it's own.  It kept moving and by the time I powered it down it crashed into the pier and ripped out the camera connector.
It went counterweight up and 90 degrees in Dec.

What in the world happened? And how can I recover and have faith in the mount???
Tom


Ray Gralak
 

Hi Tom,

When you get a chance, please use the APCC Log zipper utility to zip your files from tonight. Please include both APCC and ASCOM driver logs.

-Ray

-----Original Message-----
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tom Blahovici
Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2021 9:52 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: [ap-gto] Disaster strikes with my AP1100!

Wow, no idea what happened...

I've had my Ap1100 for about 2 months now. I was imaging tonight and everything was great. I did about 3
hours, tracking was 0.31 arcsec RMS.

All of a sudden the guide starts were lost. I restarted my sequence (I use Voyager) and the mount would slew
but plate solves were failing. I did a park 3 and noticed that the position is off. I then closed down everything,
loosened the clutches and reset everything to the right position. Next I powered down and restarted the PC. I
started APCC, did an initialize and then noticed that the mount started moving on it's own. It kept moving and
by the time I powered it down it crashed into the pier and ripped out the camera connector.
It went counterweight up and 90 degrees in Dec.

What in the world happened? And how can I recover and have faith in the mount???
Tom


fernandorivera3
 

Try & see how the mount responds to park commands from the keypad hand controller before connecting <the mount> to your computer. 

Fernando


Tom Blahovici
 

I powered up the mount and did a park 3 with the clutches loose using the hand pad.  That seemed fine I then did a couple of east west movements with the handpad.  The west movement started making a horrible noise and then the mount stopped moving although the motor was running. Sounds to me like the worm is out of place?


Tom Blahovici
 

Ok,
Turns out that the middle gear in the gear box was loose.  Thus it was slipping.  With the help of George, I got everything back to normal.
Of course I will need to redo PEM and my model.
I have attached the log files.  Perhaps this can shed some light as to what has happened?
Thanks, Tom

Updated to include the previous logs. The last known good image downloaded was at 11:20 PM.  So the faults happened after this.


Tom Blahovici
 
Edited

To close this thread I have determined how the issue occurred by ;looking at the logs in Voyager.
The first indication of an issue was an alarm from Voyager indicating that the guide star from PhD guider was lost.  After several losses in a row, Voyager attempts to do a precise goto followed by a plate solve.  This started failing with the error that the mount was 50 arc seconds off.  This was repeated a few times, all with no indication that the mount was moving at all.  Then Voyager aborted the sequence.
The problem at this point was obvious.  The middle gear in the gear box lost it's mesh since the bolt on the pivot arm was loose.  Everything else after this point that I tried to do to correct the situation lead to the mount not being in the right position depending on the direction of motion leading to a pier crash.
The mount is quite new.  Having had no more than 20 hours of use.

I'd like to suggest that Astro-Physics use a torque device to set these screws and perhaps a dab of locktite (the kind that is easy to undo).
I hope that no permanent damage occurred here.

On the up side, the mount is no longer noisy in RA slews whereas before it was quite noisy with a clattering.
Tom


Roland Christen
 

I will definitely inform our assembly people about this. It shoudl not have loosened, of course. Sorry about your bad experience.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Blahovici <tom.va2fsq@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Dec 16, 2021 10:49 am
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Disaster strikes with my AP1100!

To close this thread I have determined how the issue occurred by ;looking at the logs in Voyager.
The first indication of an issue was an alarm from Voyager indicating that the guide star from PhD guider was lost.  After several losses in a row, Voyager attempts to do a precise goto followed by a plate solve.  This started failing with the error that the mount was 50 arc seconds off.  This was repeated a few times, all with no indication that the mount was moving at all.  Then Voyager aborted the sequence.
The problem at this point was obvious.  The middle gear in the gear box lost it's mesh since the bolt on the pivot arm was loose.  Everything else after this point that I tried to do to correct the situation lead to the mount not being in the right position depending on the direction of motion leading to a pier crash.
The mount is quite new.  Having had no more than 20 hours of use.

I'd like to suggest that Astro-Physics use a torque device to set these screws and perhaps a dab of locktite (the kind that is easy to undo).
I hope that no permanent damage occurred here.

Tom

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Tom Blahovici
 

Any risk to the tracking ability due to this? I do not see any broken or chipped teeth anywhere.
Tom


Roland Christen
 

No risk to tracking ability. These are strong steel gears.

Roland

-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Blahovici <tom.va2fsq@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Dec 16, 2021 2:49 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Disaster strikes with my AP1100!

Any risk to the tracking ability due to this? I do not see any broken or chipped teeth anywhere.
Tom

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Tom Blahovici
 

Ok. Thanks. I get to practice my PEM creation skills 


Tom Blahovici
 

Pem created.  There is no measurable difference from what I got from the factory!
Good to know.