Dec-Arc Tracking in APCC Pro v1.9 - an explainer please?
I am interested in hearing how the new Dec-Arc feature in v1.9 works.
I set up my mount for each session. I always know my object in advance of setup so I then run an abbreviated model which contains about 3 or 4 lines which bracket the declination of my object for the night.
This has been working great for me for about a year now at focal lengths of 380mm and 540mm.
The image below is an example of how I would set up a modeling run for an object at +60 degrees decination:
I have looked in the on line help file for APCC Pro and APPM and only see mention of the Dec-Arc feature in the "New Features" section.
So, my question is: How do I implement this new feature other than setting the check box? Does the Dec-Arc feature still require a "standard" APPM modeling run such as what I have been doing above? Lastly, if I have already performed a APPM mapping run, then how will the Dec-Arc feature benefit me?
Thanks in advance for the help.
--
Dean Jacobsen
Astrobin Image Gallery - https://www.astrobin.com/users/deanjacobsen/
Hi Dean,
In a nutshell:
The all-sky models produce a tracking rate derived from the best-fit pointing terms across all its data points. However, it is possible that the equipment has some un-modeled pointing characteristics. If so, then the tracking rate will not account for those un-modeled characteristics.
The declination-arc model is designed specifically for calculating tracking rates inclusive of any un-modeled characteristics. It does this by measuring the changes in pointing error along the declination arcs like in your screenshot. The more values in each arc the better the tracking rate modeling will be. Tracking rates are interpolated between declination arcs so the entire region encompassed by the sky data points is covered.
Some notes about this:
1) Dec-Arc Tracking is only used for tracking rate calculations. The all-sky model, which is also calculated by APCC, still handles pointing.
2) Tracking rate correction only works within the area in which sky points are measured. When outside that area APCC uses the all-sky tracking rate model. The All-Sky model will also extrapolate outside of the sky data points that were collected.
BTW, when I mention “All-Sky” model above, I mean one of the four model combinations: East/West, Counterweight Up/Down.
-Ray
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2021 10:06 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: [ap-gto] Dec-Arc Tracking in APCC Pro v1.9 - an explainer please?
Hi All,
I am interested in hearing how the new Dec-Arc feature in v1.9 works.
I set up my mount for each session. I always know my object in advance of setup so I then run an abbreviated model which contains about 3 or 4 lines which bracket the declination of my object for the night.
This has been working great for me for about a year now at focal lengths of 380mm and 540mm.
The image below is an example of how I would set up a modeling run for an object at +60 degrees decination:
I have looked in the on line help file for APCC Pro and APPM and only see mention of the Dec-Arc feature in the "New Features" section.
So, my question is: How do I implement this new feature other than setting the check box? Does the Dec-Arc feature still require a "standard" APPM modeling run such as what I have been doing above? Lastly, if I have already performed a APPM mapping run, then how will the Dec-Arc feature benefit me?
Thanks in advance for the help.
--
Dean Jacobsen
Astrobin Image Gallery - https://www.astrobin.com/users/deanjacobsen/
So, there needs to be a APPM data acquisition and then APCC applies the data as is usual for a tracking rate model. The Dec-Arc Tracking is another layer of precision on top of the APCC tracking model that I have been using... right?
In the example that I have provided above, are the APPM settings - 3 degree declination spacing and 9 degree RA spacing - good enough for a good Dec-Arc Tracking result for a target at +60 degrees declination? ... or should I tighten up the spacing up a little?
I suspect I am going to hear "it depends". :-) Perhaps longer focal lengths will require closer spacing. The spacing I am using now works great for unguided images of up to 240 sec. at 380mm and 540mm.
--
Dean Jacobsen
Astrobin Image Gallery - https://www.astrobin.com/users/deanjacobsen/
Hi Dean,
In a nutshell:
The all-sky models produce a tracking rate derived from the best-fit pointing terms across all its data points. However, it is possible that the equipment has some un-modeled pointing characteristics. If so, then the tracking rate will not account for those un-modeled characteristics.
The declination-arc model is designed specifically for calculating tracking rates inclusive of any un-modeled characteristics. It does this by measuring the changes in pointing error along the declination arcs like in your screenshot. The more values in each arc the better the tracking rate modeling will be. Tracking rates are interpolated between declination arcs so the entire region encompassed by the sky data points is covered.
Some notes about this:
1) Dec-Arc Tracking is only used for tracking rate calculations. The all-sky model, which is also calculated by APCC, still handles pointing.
2) Tracking rate correction only works within the area in which sky points are measured. When outside that area APCC uses the all-sky tracking rate model. The All-Sky model will also extrapolate outside of the sky data points that were collected.
BTW, when I mention “All-Sky” model above, I mean one of the four model combinations: East/West, Counterweight Up/Down.
-Ray
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dean Jacobsen
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2021 10:06 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: [ap-gto] Dec-Arc Tracking in APCC Pro v1.9 - an explainer please?
Hi All,
I am interested in hearing how the new Dec-Arc feature in v1.9 works.
I set up my mount for each session. I always know my object in advance of setup so I then run an abbreviated model which contains about 3 or 4 lines which bracket the declination of my object for the night.
This has been working great for me for about a year now at focal lengths of 380mm and 540mm.
The image below is an example of how I would set up a modeling run for an object at +60 degrees decination:
I have looked in the on line help file for APCC Pro and APPM and only see mention of the Dec-Arc feature in the "New Features" section.
So, my question is: How do I implement this new feature other than setting the check box? Does the Dec-Arc feature still require a "standard" APPM modeling run such as what I have been doing above? Lastly, if I have already performed a APPM mapping run, then how will the Dec-Arc feature benefit me?
Thanks in advance for the help.
--
Dean Jacobsen
Astrobin Image Gallery - https://www.astrobin.com/users/deanjacobsen/
I was initially wondering if there was another set or type of APPM data that needed to be acquired to implement the feature.
--
Dean Jacobsen
Astrobin Image Gallery - https://www.astrobin.com/users/deanjacobsen/
Seeking to know if the option of the 4 new functionalities is worth it for me and more particularly this one, the question that you ask Dean interests me too. I have a little trouble understanding why, while using an AllSky model, checking the option on APCC would be more effective in a given sector than elsewhere, without being told what to do with it. acts.
I think that some clarification on this operation would not harm, because for me it is witchcraft.
Dominique
Hi,
Seeking to know if the option of the 4 new functionalities is worth it for me and more particularly this one, the question that you ask Dean interests me too. I have a little trouble understanding why, while using an AllSky model, checking the option on APCC would be more effective in a given sector than elsewhere, without being told what to do with it. acts.
I think that some clarification on this operation would not harm, because for me it is witchcraft.
Dominique
From: Dean Jacobsen <deanjacobsen@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Aug 18, 2021 3:54 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Dec-Arc Tracking in APCC Pro v1.9 - an explainer please?
So, there needs to be a APPM data acquisition and then APCC applies the data as is usual for a tracking rate model. The Dec-Arc Tracking is another layer of precision on top of the APCC tracking model that I have been using... right?
In the example that I have provided above, are the APPM settings - 3 degree declination spacing and 9 degree RA spacing - good enough for a good Dec-Arc Tracking result for a target at +60 degrees declination? ... or should I tighten up the spacing up a little?
I suspect I am going to hear "it depends". :-) Perhaps longer focal lengths will require closer spacing. The spacing I am using now works great for unguided images of up to 240 sec. at 380mm and 540mm.
--
Dean Jacobsen
Astrobin Image Gallery - https://www.astrobin.com/users/deanjacobsen/
--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics
Now that I have understood the license renewal mode, I don't mind paying $ 100 to participate in the evolution of the functionalities, but even if I am sure that it is interesting for me to have this option I I would like to know more about the method used and therefore why on the sector where we want to image it works and not on another. There is something to be done to say that it is on this sector that we are imaging. Perhaps by checking the option just before imaging and therefore by being on the object to be imaged.
Dominique
Thanks Roland. What if there is going to be a pier flip during the night? How do I set that up? Do I just set up a one line APPM run with a meridian flip? Something just isn’t clicking in my mind on how to set this feature up. I guess I will just wait for an example on setting it up to be posted.Hi Dean,With Dec-Arc tracking you can model just the Dec arc of the object that you are imaging. You don't need the entire sky model for this to work.
--
Dean Jacobsen
Astrobin Image Gallery - https://www.astrobin.com/users/deanjacobsen/
From: David Johnson <dajohns37@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Aug 18, 2021 7:40 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Dec-Arc Tracking in APCC Pro v1.9 - an explainer please?
--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics
Also when uninstalling the previous version (I assume through windows control panel) do any steps need to be taken to ensure setting are not lost? Should Profile and model be saved outside of their native folders prior to uninstall?
Thanks!
From: Chris White <chris.white@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Aug 18, 2021 9:33 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Dec-Arc Tracking in APCC Pro v1.9 - an explainer please?
Also when uninstalling the previous version (I assume through windows control panel) do any steps need to be taken to ensure setting are not lost? Should Profile and model be saved outside of their native folders prior to uninstall?
Thanks!
--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics
Dec arc tracking is an independent model, not relying on the all-sky model. neither relies on the other to work.Now I am confused. How is the model created? How do we obtain the data?
I am going to have to wait for the manual.
--
Dean Jacobsen
Astrobin Image Gallery - https://www.astrobin.com/users/deanjacobsen/
Now I am confused. How is the model created? How do we obtain the data?
From: Dean Jacobsen <deanjacobsen@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Aug 18, 2021 10:25 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Dec-Arc Tracking in APCC Pro v1.9 - an explainer please?
Dec arc tracking is an independent model, not relying on the all-sky model. neither relies on the other to work.Now I am confused. How is the model created? How do we obtain the data?
I am going to have to wait for the manual.
--
Dean Jacobsen
Astrobin Image Gallery - https://www.astrobin.com/users/deanjacobsen/
--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics
Dean
As an example I do 900sec subs unguided with just Dec Arc tracking @ 480mm on the ASI6200
https://www.brianvalentephotography.com/astrophotography/i-DwvmwzK/A
The tracking is so good that when i'm pixel peeping all i see is the slight backfocus issue that elongates my stars in the corners.
Brian
--
Dean Jacobsen
Astrobin Image Gallery - https://www.astrobin.com/users/deanjacobsen/