Power cable conductor gage (AWG) of


Bryan R.
 

I am a fan of Switchcraft DC jacks.  They seem to be of much better quality than run-of-the-mill amazon stuff, bit easier to solder, and made in USA.  Would like to hear that others have used for ethernet RJ45 connectors if fabricating their own patch cables as I do.


Eric Claeys
 

People talk about "high quality" cables and connectors.  What are some examples/brands of high quality ethernet and USB cables?   Are Power Pole connectors high quality?

Eric


Seb@stro
 

Thanks Greg. You are correct. But if you read carefully, you’ll see it’s basically what came out of the first posts of this thread.

CS!
Sébastien

Le 9 avr. 2021 à 17:38, Greg McCall <emailgregnow@gmail.com> a écrit :

Also, keep in mind it's not just the cable thickness by itself. The length of cable is also part of the equation (as well as if it's in a bundle, underground, if it's double insulated, etc.).

If you have a long cable run, you will need a thicker cable.

The advice of checking the voltage drop with a multimeter is a good way of checking it. Check it under the load conditions such as with motors running, dew heater on max and camera cooler on max during initial warm-up all at the same time.


Seb@stro
 

Looks like this thread is turning into a “free advice” private club party. Where do I sign up? I wanna laugh too! ;)

Putting it back on track, thanks to Jack for his detailed recommendations. They were almost all on my check list but maybe not on everyone’s.
 
My USB3 cables are no longer than 3ft from devices to hub and are good quality shielded TrippLite cable for the exact reasons you mentioned: signal integrity needs care at USB3 freqs.
 
All unused connectors are covered either by proper covers (or electrical tape until I get some).
 
The junction point of the mount power-wise will be with a harness cable I’ll make with PowerPole end terminals. One branch (to the mount) will be 18AWG and the other 16AWG to the PPBA via the TTM cable in the Mach2. The common end being a 14AWG (also terminated with PPole) to the battery.

No need for a distribution panel in my case, the PegasusPBA wired to the mount’s internal cabling does it all.

I’ll try to post a pic of my setup if I get to wake up before dusk tomorrow. Now is imaging time! :)

CS!
Sébastien
 

 


Don Anderson
 

Ah the supplenessEmoji

Don Anderson


On Friday, April 9, 2021, 01:48:09 p.m. MDT, Christopher Erickson <christopher.k.erickson@...> wrote:


At least nobody started talking about skin effect, nominal velocity of propagation, current NEC electrical code requirements, insulation dielectric characteristics, breakdown voltages, mutual inductance, impedance, hysteresis, magnetic fields, reluctance, EMI shielding, plating techniques, ductility, annealing, connector MTBF, connector insertion lifetimes, NEMA ratings, EMP, lightning protection, R-56 compliance, insulation color coding, insulation UV ratings, US vs. ISO specifications, suppleness.......


-Christopher Erickson
Observatory engineer
Waikoloa, HI 96738
www.summitkinetics.com
   

On Fri, Apr 9, 2021, 9:36 AM Seb@stro <sebastiendore1@...> wrote:
Kenneth,

Yeah, tought of that but I found them a bit expensive to ship to my location (Canada) so I got them from a local dealer instead. Thanks anyway.

CS!
Sébastien


De : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> de la part de Kenneth Tan <ktanhs@...>
Envoyé : 9 avril 2021 13:47
À : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Objet : Re: [ap-gto] Power cable conductor gage (AWG) of
 
Try getting the cables from Powerwerx. They also supply the Anderson powerpole connectors. 

On Sat, 10 Apr 2021 at 01:05, Seb@stro <sebastiendore1@...> wrote:
I was looking at SJEOOW Seoprene Cu cable from Southwire (similar to the power cable that goes from the power source to 12-24V input on the CP5). Those are rated at 300V and stay quite flexible even at very low temperature (rated from -50 to 105 Celsius). The 16/2 nominal DCR is 4.05 Ohms/1000ft and composed of 26 strands of 30 AWG conductors. 

If I can find it somewhere in bulk quanity, I should be good to go.

CS!
Sébastien


Christopher Erickson
 

At least Karen didn't ban me for my candidly-irreverent reply in the semi-recent "World's Greatest Secret" UFO conspiracy thread.

I felt like I had really pegged the old Mirth-O-Meter with that one and was sort of sad to see the entire thread vanish. Probably just as well!

"Always take the high road. There's less traffic!"

-Christopher Erickson
Observatory Engineer
Summit Kinetics
Waikoloa, Hawaii


On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 2:09 PM Christopher Erickson via groups.io <christopher.k.erickson=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Maybe I should apply with AP to be an emergency-alternate backup tech support geek...

...if they would let me work from my astro-cave here in Hawaii.

"My advice is always free and worth every penny!"

-Christopher Erickson
Observatory Engineer
Summit Kinetics
Waikoloa, Hawaii


On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 1:54 PM Eric Dreher <ericpdreher@...> wrote:
I laughed out loud at this one, Chris.  I'm retired from AT&T and also hold an Extra class ham radio license.  You tempted me. :)


Bill Long
 

You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. 


From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Christopher Erickson <christopher.k.erickson@...>
Sent: Friday, April 9, 2021 5:08 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Power cable conductor gage (AWG) of
 
Maybe I should apply with AP to be an emergency-alternate backup tech support geek...

...if they would let me work from my astro-cave here in Hawaii.

"My advice is always free and worth every penny!"

-Christopher Erickson
Observatory Engineer
Summit Kinetics
Waikoloa, Hawaii


On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 1:54 PM Eric Dreher <ericpdreher@...> wrote:
I laughed out loud at this one, Chris.  I'm retired from AT&T and also hold an Extra class ham radio license.  You tempted me. :)


Eric Dreher
 

You'll never know until you ask.  :)


Christopher Erickson
 

Maybe I should apply with AP to be an emergency-alternate backup tech support geek...

...if they would let me work from my astro-cave here in Hawaii.

"My advice is always free and worth every penny!"

-Christopher Erickson
Observatory Engineer
Summit Kinetics
Waikoloa, Hawaii


On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 1:54 PM Eric Dreher <ericpdreher@...> wrote:
I laughed out loud at this one, Chris.  I'm retired from AT&T and also hold an Extra class ham radio license.  You tempted me. :)


Christopher Erickson
 

That was an attempted inoculation. LOL

"My advice is always free and worth every penny!"

-Christopher Erickson
Observatory Engineer
Summit Kinetics
Waikoloa, Hawaii


On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 10:06 AM Daniel Marcus <DMa3141551@...> wrote:
Hi Chris
don't give them any ideas LOL
Dan Marcus


From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Christopher Erickson <christopher.k.erickson@...>
Sent: Friday, April 9, 2021 3:47 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Power cable conductor gage (AWG) of
 
At least nobody started talking about skin effect, nominal velocity of propagation, current NEC electrical code requirements, insulation dielectric characteristics, breakdown voltages, mutual inductance, impedance, hysteresis, magnetic fields, reluctance, EMI shielding, plating techniques, ductility, annealing, connector MTBF, connector insertion lifetimes, NEMA ratings, EMP, lightning protection, R-56 compliance, insulation color coding, insulation UV ratings, US vs. ISO specifications, suppleness.......


-Christopher Erickson
Observatory engineer
Waikoloa, HI 96738
www.summitkinetics.com
   

On Fri, Apr 9, 2021, 9:36 AM Seb@stro <sebastiendore1@...> wrote:
Kenneth,

Yeah, tought of that but I found them a bit expensive to ship to my location (Canada) so I got them from a local dealer instead. Thanks anyway.

CS!
Sébastien


De : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> de la part de Kenneth Tan <ktanhs@...>
Envoyé : 9 avril 2021 13:47
À : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Objet : Re: [ap-gto] Power cable conductor gage (AWG) of
 
Try getting the cables from Powerwerx. They also supply the Anderson powerpole connectors. 

On Sat, 10 Apr 2021 at 01:05, Seb@stro <sebastiendore1@...> wrote:
I was looking at SJEOOW Seoprene Cu cable from Southwire (similar to the power cable that goes from the power source to 12-24V input on the CP5). Those are rated at 300V and stay quite flexible even at very low temperature (rated from -50 to 105 Celsius). The 16/2 nominal DCR is 4.05 Ohms/1000ft and composed of 26 strands of 30 AWG conductors. 

If I can find it somewhere in bulk quanity, I should be good to go.

CS!
Sébastien


Eric Dreher
 

I laughed out loud at this one, Chris.  I'm retired from AT&T and also hold an Extra class ham radio license.  You tempted me. :)


Greg McCall
 

Also, keep in mind it's not just the cable thickness by itself. The length of cable is also part of the equation (as well as if it's in a bundle, underground, if it's double insulated, etc.).

If you have a long cable run, you will need a thicker cable.

The advice of checking the voltage drop with a multimeter is a good way of checking it. Check it under the load conditions such as with motors running, dew heater on max and camera cooler on max during initial warm-up all at the same time.


Stone, Jack G
 

Migration of electrons have to exceed 740MHz to start migrating to the outer circumference of the conductor (depends on the conductor structure).  So your USB or interface cabling should account for signal attenuation or at least understand for the 15’ USB3 what is the specification!!!  Cannot go cheap on these – and ensure that they are well shielded, aluminum paper wrap is not shielding.

 

For the sake of our equipment – The mount will impart the largest di/dt.

Taking into account the data collected based on the loading (load and Fulcrum (lever) – you can ascertain at some maximum skew rate and the amount of current sinked  to mitigate violating the minimum voltage which can damage the instrument or throw off the accuracy.

 

That is the goal I would assume – taking into account the various loads from other devices; cameras, conversion factors, USB controllers and communication devices all have voltage limits.

If you exceed that minimum voltage in any of these devices you can expect inoperability. 

 

So understanding your power consumption and your input voltage vs. full load is the key goal I would suspect.

 

Minimalist path – use the thickest gauge with the highest strand count.  Source a silicon based insulator (varmints for some reason will not eat) and ensure that you contacts are sealed from moisture.  Sealed connects are important.  From your power distribution panel to the equipment. 

Purchase the best interface cables you can afford – after spending that $8K on that camera only to use dollar store USB – you would induce all that noise from the transition out of the camera to your storage device.  Does not make sense when you looking for that ultra low noise.

 

Cover unused connectors – at some point you might need them and if they are corroded it will impact the capability for the physical connection.  Some use RTV or clear silicon caulking.

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Seb@stro
Sent: Friday, April 09, 2021 1:12 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Power cable conductor gage (AWG) of

 

Christopher,

 

I leave half of that work to the UL/CSA compliance guys. 

 

And then, skin effect and velocity of propagation at 0Hz could be an interesting discussion... 😉

 

CS!

Sébastien

 


De : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> de la part de Christopher Erickson <christopher.k.erickson@...>
Envoyé : 9 avril 2021 15:47
À : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Objet : Re: [ap-gto] Power cable conductor gage (AWG) of

 

At least nobody started talking about skin effect, nominal velocity of propagation, current NEC electrical code requirements, insulation dielectric characteristics, breakdown voltages, mutual inductance, impedance, hysteresis, magnetic fields, reluctance, EMI shielding, plating techniques, ductility, annealing, connector MTBF, connector insertion lifetimes, NEMA ratings, EMP, lightning protection, R-56 compliance, insulation color coding, insulation UV ratings, US vs. ISO specifications, suppleness.......


-Christopher Erickson
Observatory engineer
Waikoloa, HI 96738
www.summitkinetics.com
   


Seb@stro
 

Christopher,

I leave half of that work to the UL/CSA compliance guys. 

And then, skin effect and velocity of propagation at 0Hz could be an interesting discussion... 😉

CS!
Sébastien


De : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> de la part de Christopher Erickson <christopher.k.erickson@...>
Envoyé : 9 avril 2021 15:47
À : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Objet : Re: [ap-gto] Power cable conductor gage (AWG) of
 
At least nobody started talking about skin effect, nominal velocity of propagation, current NEC electrical code requirements, insulation dielectric characteristics, breakdown voltages, mutual inductance, impedance, hysteresis, magnetic fields, reluctance, EMI shielding, plating techniques, ductility, annealing, connector MTBF, connector insertion lifetimes, NEMA ratings, EMP, lightning protection, R-56 compliance, insulation color coding, insulation UV ratings, US vs. ISO specifications, suppleness.......


-Christopher Erickson
Observatory engineer
Waikoloa, HI 96738
www.summitkinetics.com
   
_._,_._,_


Daniel Marcus
 

Hi Chris
don't give them any ideas LOL
Dan Marcus


From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> on behalf of Christopher Erickson <christopher.k.erickson@...>
Sent: Friday, April 9, 2021 3:47 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Power cable conductor gage (AWG) of
 
At least nobody started talking about skin effect, nominal velocity of propagation, current NEC electrical code requirements, insulation dielectric characteristics, breakdown voltages, mutual inductance, impedance, hysteresis, magnetic fields, reluctance, EMI shielding, plating techniques, ductility, annealing, connector MTBF, connector insertion lifetimes, NEMA ratings, EMP, lightning protection, R-56 compliance, insulation color coding, insulation UV ratings, US vs. ISO specifications, suppleness.......


-Christopher Erickson
Observatory engineer
Waikoloa, HI 96738
www.summitkinetics.com
   

On Fri, Apr 9, 2021, 9:36 AM Seb@stro <sebastiendore1@...> wrote:
Kenneth,

Yeah, tought of that but I found them a bit expensive to ship to my location (Canada) so I got them from a local dealer instead. Thanks anyway.

CS!
Sébastien


De : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> de la part de Kenneth Tan <ktanhs@...>
Envoyé : 9 avril 2021 13:47
À : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Objet : Re: [ap-gto] Power cable conductor gage (AWG) of
 
Try getting the cables from Powerwerx. They also supply the Anderson powerpole connectors. 

On Sat, 10 Apr 2021 at 01:05, Seb@stro <sebastiendore1@...> wrote:
I was looking at SJEOOW Seoprene Cu cable from Southwire (similar to the power cable that goes from the power source to 12-24V input on the CP5). Those are rated at 300V and stay quite flexible even at very low temperature (rated from -50 to 105 Celsius). The 16/2 nominal DCR is 4.05 Ohms/1000ft and composed of 26 strands of 30 AWG conductors. 

If I can find it somewhere in bulk quanity, I should be good to go.

CS!
Sébastien


Seb@stro
 

Mike,

Technically, all the points made were valid, but practically, to power an AP mount, don't over-think it! 

It doesn't change a thing if the mount is an AP or other brand, minimum voltage requirement needs to be met for proper operation. 

Besides, the extension I plan to make with that cable isn't even to power the mount, but rather my pegasus powerbox to which all cameras, NUC and peripherals are connected. All this can pull significant amperage at times, hence causing the undesirable voltage drop (the NUC is the most unpredictable part of the system). I should probably have added that my setup is for 100% portable use (so weight is also a concern) and aims to be powered by a single 12V 24Ah sealed battery, even in the cold winter nights I can get at my place (-20 to -25C).

But to those who don't require/like to fiddle with that level of optimization, I agree using a higher gauge might be the way to go...

CS!
Sébastien


Christopher Erickson
 

At least nobody started talking about skin effect, nominal velocity of propagation, current NEC electrical code requirements, insulation dielectric characteristics, breakdown voltages, mutual inductance, impedance, hysteresis, magnetic fields, reluctance, EMI shielding, plating techniques, ductility, annealing, connector MTBF, connector insertion lifetimes, NEMA ratings, EMP, lightning protection, R-56 compliance, insulation color coding, insulation UV ratings, US vs. ISO specifications, suppleness.......


-Christopher Erickson
Observatory engineer
Waikoloa, HI 96738
www.summitkinetics.com
   

On Fri, Apr 9, 2021, 9:36 AM Seb@stro <sebastiendore1@...> wrote:
Kenneth,

Yeah, tought of that but I found them a bit expensive to ship to my location (Canada) so I got them from a local dealer instead. Thanks anyway.

CS!
Sébastien


De : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> de la part de Kenneth Tan <ktanhs@...>
Envoyé : 9 avril 2021 13:47
À : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Objet : Re: [ap-gto] Power cable conductor gage (AWG) of
 
Try getting the cables from Powerwerx. They also supply the Anderson powerpole connectors. 

On Sat, 10 Apr 2021 at 01:05, Seb@stro <sebastiendore1@...> wrote:
I was looking at SJEOOW Seoprene Cu cable from Southwire (similar to the power cable that goes from the power source to 12-24V input on the CP5). Those are rated at 300V and stay quite flexible even at very low temperature (rated from -50 to 105 Celsius). The 16/2 nominal DCR is 4.05 Ohms/1000ft and composed of 26 strands of 30 AWG conductors. 

If I can find it somewhere in bulk quanity, I should be good to go.

CS!
Sébastien


Seb@stro
 

Kenneth,

Yeah, tought of that but I found them a bit expensive to ship to my location (Canada) so I got them from a local dealer instead. Thanks anyway.

CS!
Sébastien


De : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> de la part de Kenneth Tan <ktanhs@...>
Envoyé : 9 avril 2021 13:47
À : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Objet : Re: [ap-gto] Power cable conductor gage (AWG) of
 
Try getting the cables from Powerwerx. They also supply the Anderson powerpole connectors. 

On Sat, 10 Apr 2021 at 01:05, Seb@stro <sebastiendore1@...> wrote:
I was looking at SJEOOW Seoprene Cu cable from Southwire (similar to the power cable that goes from the power source to 12-24V input on the CP5). Those are rated at 300V and stay quite flexible even at very low temperature (rated from -50 to 105 Celsius). The 16/2 nominal DCR is 4.05 Ohms/1000ft and composed of 26 strands of 30 AWG conductors. 

If I can find it somewhere in bulk quanity, I should be good to go.

CS!
Sébastien


Seb@stro
 

Some of you people are REALLY over-thinking this...

Christopher, I plead guilty. 😬

But as you'll certainly agree, better do it right once and for all. I personnaly don't like oversizing everything just to be on the safe side when I know I can optimize something. But that's just me, trying to pull every tenth of an ounce of performance out of my equipment... 

And hey, system integration is half the fun of this hobby. Using AP equipement doesn't leave many things to fuss with so I thought why not try to bring the rest to the same standard.

CS!
Sébastien


Mike Dodd
 

On 4/9/2021 1:52 PM, Christopher Erickson wrote:
Some of you people are REALLY over-thinking this...
That's what I was going to say.

Technically, all the points made were valid, but practically, to power an AP mount, don't over-think it! Get some 16AWG insulated stranded copper wire (14AWG for REALLY long runs), and be done with it.

--- Mike
http://astronomy.mdodd.com