Topics

second attempt: meridian management with mach2 please...help


Andrea Lucchetti
 

Thank you Ray

>assuming I understand why you want the scope to avoid the meridian?
that was confusing sorry, a mix of language barrier and poor understanding of the meridian logic.
I think I have all the elements to make some experiments now.

Thanks a lot
Andrea

Il giorno mer 25 nov 2020 alle ore 18:16 Ray Gralak <groups3@...> ha scritto:
Hi Andrea,

> So my question was directed to understand better the connection between
> settings in AE tab and MERIDIAN tab, if they are the same and which is better.

Yes, that is true, but there is only one set of limits in the mount, so when a pier flip is issued, the limits will get reprogrammed for the destination pier-side and declination. During the pier flip, the scope can potentially point close to the meridian.

So, if you are trying to prevent a possible pier collision near the meridian, I don't think the limits can necessarily prevent that. There might have to be a multipoint slew algorithm developed, assuming I understand why you want the scope to avoid the meridian?

-Ray Gralak
Author of PEMPro
Author of APCC (Astro-Physics Command Center): https://www.astro-physics.com/apcc-pro
Author of Astro-Physics V2 ASCOM Driver: https://www.siriusimaging.com/apdriver

> -----Original Message-----
> From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Andrea Lucchetti
> Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2020 11:40 PM
> To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
> Subject: Re: [ap-gto] second attempt: meridian management with mach2 please...help
>
> hello,
> in the AE tab, it seems you can also set AR & DEC limits: this tab in my understanding has the same functionalities of
> the "HOME/LIMIT" tab of non AE mounts.
>
> In the help file: "the RA limits that you set here will override any custom meridian limit you may have set on the
> Meridian Tab. These limits are the preferred choice  for those using automation software...."
>
> So my question was directed to understand better the connection between settings in AE tab and MERIDIAN tab, if
> they are the same and which is better.
>
> Thank you for your help,
> Andrea
>
> Il giorno mer 25 nov 2020 alle ore 02:32 Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> ha scritto:
>
>
>
>               what about AE tab?
>
>       What do you mean by AE tab? What is your question about AE?
>
>
>
>       AE refers to absolute Encoders. In the Mach2 the encoders are not available for you to turn on or off, and they
> have nothing to do with flipping the mount or reaching the meridian. The encoders are permanently on, cannot be
> turned off. They control the axis positions and tracking speed.
>
>
>
>       Rolando
>
>
>
>       -----Original Message-----
>       From: Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@...>
>       To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
>       Sent: Tue, Nov 24, 2020 6:09 pm
>       Subject: Re: [ap-gto] second attempt: meridian management with mach2 please...help
>
>
>       thank you.
>       I think option 2 can work for me.
>       my final objective is to work with CCDAP , so after 45 min when a slew is commanded by CCDAP the mount
> will flip.
>
>       what about AE tab?
>       it seems like option 2 but you can set also the behaviour when the limit is reached, no?
>
>       thank you again,
>       Andrea
>
>       --
>       Roland Christen
>       Astro-Physics
>
>
>
>
>
>







Ray Gralak
 

Hi Andrea,

So my question was directed to understand better the connection between
settings in AE tab and MERIDIAN tab, if they are the same and which is better.
Yes, that is true, but there is only one set of limits in the mount, so when a pier flip is issued, the limits will get reprogrammed for the destination pier-side and declination. During the pier flip, the scope can potentially point close to the meridian.

So, if you are trying to prevent a possible pier collision near the meridian, I don't think the limits can necessarily prevent that. There might have to be a multipoint slew algorithm developed, assuming I understand why you want the scope to avoid the meridian?

-Ray Gralak
Author of PEMPro
Author of APCC (Astro-Physics Command Center): https://www.astro-physics.com/apcc-pro
Author of Astro-Physics V2 ASCOM Driver: https://www.siriusimaging.com/apdriver

-----Original Message-----
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Andrea Lucchetti
Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2020 11:40 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] second attempt: meridian management with mach2 please...help

hello,
in the AE tab, it seems you can also set AR & DEC limits: this tab in my understanding has the same functionalities of
the "HOME/LIMIT" tab of non AE mounts.

In the help file: "the RA limits that you set here will override any custom meridian limit you may have set on the
Meridian Tab. These limits are the preferred choice for those using automation software...."

So my question was directed to understand better the connection between settings in AE tab and MERIDIAN tab, if
they are the same and which is better.

Thank you for your help,
Andrea

Il giorno mer 25 nov 2020 alle ore 02:32 Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> ha scritto:



what about AE tab?

What do you mean by AE tab? What is your question about AE?



AE refers to absolute Encoders. In the Mach2 the encoders are not available for you to turn on or off, and they
have nothing to do with flipping the mount or reaching the meridian. The encoders are permanently on, cannot be
turned off. They control the axis positions and tracking speed.



Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@gmail.com>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Nov 24, 2020 6:09 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] second attempt: meridian management with mach2 please...help


thank you.
I think option 2 can work for me.
my final objective is to work with CCDAP , so after 45 min when a slew is commanded by CCDAP the mount
will flip.

what about AE tab?
it seems like option 2 but you can set also the behaviour when the limit is reached, no?

thank you again,
Andrea

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics






Andrea Lucchetti
 

Ray/Roland,
I think the only piece I am missing now is related to the limit you can set in AE TAB.
is it equivalent to set a meridian delay+meridian tracking limits?
I understand I need to switch the limits in the AE tab if I want to set the behaviours in the "meridian limit tab".
If on the contrary I want to work on the AE TAB limits, they completely override any settting of limits and delays in the Meridian limit panel?
what is the best option to work with CCD Autopilot?

Thanks a lot
Andrea


Andrea Lucchetti
 

hello, 
in the AE tab, it seems you can also set AR & DEC limits: this tab in my understanding has the same functionalities of the "HOME/LIMIT" tab of non AE mounts.

In the help file: "the RA limits that you set here will override any custom meridian limit you may have set on the Meridian Tab. These limits are the preferred choice  for those using automation software...."

So my question was directed to understand better the connection between settings in AE tab and MERIDIAN tab, if they are the same and which is better.

Thank you for your help,
Andrea


Il giorno mer 25 nov 2020 alle ore 02:32 Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> ha scritto:

what about AE tab?
What do you mean by AE tab? What is your question about AE?

AE refers to absolute Encoders. In the Mach2 the encoders are not available for you to turn on or off, and they have nothing to do with flipping the mount or reaching the meridian. The encoders are permanently on, cannot be turned off. They control the axis positions and tracking speed.

Rolando


-----Original Message-----
From: Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Nov 24, 2020 6:09 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] second attempt: meridian management with mach2 please...help

thank you.
I think option 2 can work for me.
my final objective is to work with CCDAP , so after 45 min when a slew is commanded by CCDAP the mount will flip.

what about AE tab?
it seems like option 2 but you can set also the behaviour when the limit is reached, no?

thank you again,
Andrea

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Ray Gralak
 

Hi Andrea,

My previous thread didn't get a single comment so I suspect the manual
is not that clear: I though it was my fault
The concept of "meridian delay" is an attribute of the Astro-Physics mount firmware. It is not specific to APCC. For example, you can set the meridian delay using the mount's keypad and the AP V2 ASCOM driver.

The meridian delay is used to define the mount's flip point, which is at mount startup set to the meridian (i.e., meridian delay = 0). Any commanded GOTO to the East of the flip point will cause the mount to point the scope to commanded RA/Dec with the pier-side on the West. Likewise, and commanded GOTO to the West of the flip point will cause the mount to point to the commanded RA/Dec with the pier-side set to the East.

When the mount tracks past the meridian delay value, the mount does not automatically flip. For the mount to flip, a GOTO must be commanded.

What APCC adds is a variable meridian delay based on mount declination and pier side. APCC also allows for certain actions when a limit is reached, like stopping mount tracking, or doing a pier flip.

I'd like to know what is the simplest meridian management set up to be used with APCC Pro and the Mach2.
I don't need any complex management, only things like:
-to allow for 45 min tracking in the West before meridian flip, about 45 min east tracking (less important)
-prevent slewing near the meridian
Currently, there is no way to prevent slewing near the meridian in APCC. However, you can set the east and west limits to 45 minutes before and after the meridian using the meridian limits editor.

-Ray Gralak
Author of PEMPro
Author of APCC (Astro-Physics Command Center): https://www.astro-physics.com/apcc-pro
Author of Astro-Physics V2 ASCOM Driver: https://www.siriusimaging.com/apdriver

-----Original Message-----
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Andrea Lucchetti
Sent: Tuesday, November 24, 2020 3:15 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: [ap-gto] second attempt: meridian management with mach2 please...help

Hi,
I am trying one more time to stimulate a discussion on the topic.
My previous thread didn't get a single comment so I suspect the manual is not that clear: I though it was my fault
but it seems that this is a topic at least not very interesting if not intimidating :-)

I will try to simplify things compared to my previous post:
I have a Mach2 and it is going to be used in the field, no fixed set up.

I'd like to know what is the simplest meridian management set up to be used with APCC Pro and the Mach2.
I don't need any complex management, only things like:
-to allow for 45 min tracking in the West before meridian flip, about 45 min east tracking (less important)
-prevent slewing near the meridian

After having read many, many times the manual, I am still confused
I wonder if setting only the AE limits it is enough for me . in this case it would be nice to know how to set the
"Meridian panel" in APCC:

I assume I don't need to set "meridian delay"
I assume I don't have to touch the "meridian tracking limits/hour angle panel"
I assume I don't need to flag "enable Meridian Tracking limits" in "Operation" panel, because in the help I read:
"DO NOT use any other method for setting a meridian delay while you are using the meridian limits. When
properly configured, the APCC meridian tracking limit logic will maintain the correct meridian delay in the system."



Thank you very much in advance,
Andrea


Roland Christen
 


what about AE tab?
What do you mean by AE tab? What is your question about AE?

AE refers to absolute Encoders. In the Mach2 the encoders are not available for you to turn on or off, and they have nothing to do with flipping the mount or reaching the meridian. The encoders are permanently on, cannot be turned off. They control the axis positions and tracking speed.

Rolando


-----Original Message-----
From: Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Nov 24, 2020 6:09 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] second attempt: meridian management with mach2 please...help

thank you.
I think option 2 can work for me.
my final objective is to work with CCDAP , so after 45 min when a slew is commanded by CCDAP the mount will flip.

what about AE tab?
it seems like option 2 but you can set also the behaviour when the limit is reached, no?

thank you again,
Andrea

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Roland Christen
 

I think I will let Ray answer that.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Nov 24, 2020 6:09 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] second attempt: meridian management with mach2 please...help

thank you.
I think option 2 can work for me.
my final objective is to work with CCDAP , so after 45 min when a slew is commanded by CCDAP the mount will flip.

what about AE tab?
it seems like option 2 but you can set also the behaviour when the limit is reached, no?

thank you again,
Andrea

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Andrea Lucchetti
 

thank you.
I think option 2 can work for me.
my final objective is to work with CCDAP , so after 45 min when a slew is commanded by CCDAP the mount will flip.

what about AE tab?
it seems like option 2 but you can set also the behaviour when the limit is reached, no?

thank you again,
Andrea


Roland Christen
 


I don't need any complex management, only things like:
-to allow for 45 min tracking in the west before meridian flip, about 45 min east tracking (less important) 
1) Turn off the limits and the mount will track past the meridian for however long you have it powered. The mount will not automatically flip to the other side. Once past the meridian you simply enter the same object and perform a GoTo. The mount will then flip.

2) If you don't want the mount to flip for 45 minutes past with a GoTo, you can do a Meridian Delay 1 hour West. Then you will not flip sides with a GoTo until after that 1 hour meridian line is reached.

3) Finally, you can flip the mount at any time before or after the meridian by issuing a "Flip Mount" command.

4) If you leave the Limits ON, then the mount will stop just past the meridian wherever you have set the meridian. The mount will not flip automatically. You have to issue a flip command.

You have at least 4 choices as outlined above. Try them all and see which one suits your purpose.

Rolando


-----Original Message-----
From: Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Nov 24, 2020 5:15 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] second attempt: meridian management with mach2 please...help

Hi,
I am trying one more time to stimulate a discussion on the topic.
My previous thread didn't get a single comment so I suspect the manual is not that clear: I though it was my fault but it seems that this is a topic at least not very interesting if not intimidating :-)

I will try to simplify things compared to my previous post:
I have a Mach2 and it is going to be used in the field, no fixed set up.

I'd like to know what is the simplest meridian management  set up to be used with APCC Pro and the Mach2.
I don't need any complex management, only things like:
-to allow for 45 min tracking in the west before meridian flip, about 45 min east tracking (less important) 
-prevent slewing near the meridian

After having read many, many times the manual, I am still confused 
I wonder if setting only the AE limits it is enough for me . in this case it would be nice to know how to set the "Meridian panel" in APCC:

I assume I don't need to set "meridian delay"
I assume I don't have to touch the "meridian tracking limits/hour angle panel"
I assume I don't need to flag "enable Meridian Tracking limits" in "Operation" panel, because in the help I read: "DO NOT use any other method for setting a meridian delay while you are using the meridian limits.  When properly configured, the APCC meridian tracking limit logic will maintain the correct meridian delay in the system."
 


Thank you very much in advance,
Andrea
 

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Andrea Lucchetti
 

Hi,
I am trying one more time to stimulate a discussion on the topic.
My previous thread didn't get a single comment so I suspect the manual is not that clear: I though it was my fault but it seems that this is a topic at least not very interesting if not intimidating :-)

I will try to simplify things compared to my previous post:
I have a Mach2 and it is going to be used in the field, no fixed set up.

I'd like to know what is the simplest meridian management  set up to be used with APCC Pro and the Mach2.
I don't need any complex management, only things like:
-to allow for 45 min tracking in the west before meridian flip, about 45 min east tracking (less important) 
-prevent slewing near the meridian

After having read many, many times the manual, I am still confused 
I wonder if setting only the AE limits it is enough for me . in this case it would be nice to know how to set the "Meridian panel" in APCC:

I assume I don't need to set "meridian delay"
I assume I don't have to touch the "meridian tracking limits/hour angle panel"
I assume I don't need to flag "enable Meridian Tracking limits" in "Operation" panel, because in the help I read: "DO NOT use any other method for setting a meridian delay while you are using the meridian limits.  When properly configured, the APCC meridian tracking limit logic will maintain the correct meridian delay in the system."
 


Thank you very much in advance,
Andrea