Topics

Mach1 problem please assist


Ron Kramer
 

My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  

Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately

the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.

Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.

I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 

I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  

I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  

I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 

 

 


DiscoDuck
 

Looks like that RA jump is roughly at the period of the mount's gears - 383 seconds. I had/have (intermittent) a similar problem, and it is thought from communication with George to be dirt/crud in the gears/worm somewhere. I find it tends to go away with a fast slew away and back - but does return intermittently. I have a grease kit now from AP and need to get the courage to take the mount apart and re-grease it.


Worsel
 

Ron

Have you ever switched the side of the RA gear that you are using?

See  https://ap-gto.groups.io/g/main/topic/37383266#58818

Bryan


Ron Kramer
 

DiscoDuck   okay sounds logical.  (grease) there have been times it settles and seems fine. Then it's back.   Any videos on re-greasing? I'm not good at that stuff either. 

Bryan, I'd say no... not sure what you're referring to.   Oh that link - says park1 - then manually to park 4 then unpack from 4.  (is that swapping it?)

I can try that.  Else any videos on step by step regreasing?   Even worm only?  I'm not even sure how to see it. 






On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 6:45 PM Worsel via groups.io <bryancashion=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Ron

Have you ever switched the side of the RA gear that you are using?

See  https://ap-gto.groups.io/g/main/topic/37383266#58818

Bryan




uncarollo2 <chris1011@aol.com>
 

Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.

You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 


Ron Kramer
 

I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.


On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.

You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 




Cheng-Yang Tan
 

Hi Ron,
   If you plan to re-grease, do you mind taking photos of the process. It'll help owners of the Mach1GTO out. I chickened out after reading the regreaing instructions -- I think I need the comic book version :)

cytan

On Wednesday, June 10, 2020, 01:33:17 PM CDT, Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:


I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.


On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.

You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 



--


 

Ron,

 

Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.

 

Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.

 

Clear Skies,

 

Marj Christen

Astro-Physics, Inc

11250 Forest Hills Rd

Machesney Park, IL 61115

Phone: 815-282-1513

Fax: 815-282-9847

www.astro-physics.com

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

 

I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 

I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.

 

 

On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:

Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.

 

You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.

 

Rolando

 

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  

Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately

the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.

Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.

I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 

I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  

I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  

I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 

 

 


 

--


Ron Kramer
 

Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.





On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:

Ron,

 

Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.

 

Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.

 

Clear Skies,

 

Marj Christen

Astro-Physics, Inc

11250 Forest Hills Rd

Machesney Park, IL 61115

Phone: 815-282-1513

Fax: 815-282-9847

www.astro-physics.com

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

 

I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 

I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.

 

 

On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:

Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.

 

You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.

 

Rolando

 

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  

Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately

the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.

Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.

I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 

I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  

I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  

I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 

 

 


 

--




Ron Kramer
 

I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 


RA KICK.JPG

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.





On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:

Ron,

 

Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.

 

Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.

 

Clear Skies,

 

Marj Christen

Astro-Physics, Inc

11250 Forest Hills Rd

Machesney Park, IL 61115

Phone: 815-282-1513

Fax: 815-282-9847

www.astro-physics.com

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

 

I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 

I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.

 

 

On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:

Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.

 

You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.

 

Rolando

 

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  

Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately

the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.

Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.

I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 

I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  

I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  

I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 

 

 


 

--



--




uncarollo2 <chris1011@aol.com>
 

Hello Ron,

Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.

Can you do a test for me?

With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"

Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.

By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 


RA KICK.JPG

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.





On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
--


--


--


Michael Hambrick
 

What is the time interval of those spikes ? The intervals all look to be the same which definitely suggests a worm issue.


Best Regards

Michael Hambrick
ARLANXEO
TSR Global Manufacturing Support
PO Box 2000
Orange, TX 77631-2000
Phone: +1 (409) 882-2799
email: mike.hambrick@...


uncarollo2 <chris1011@aol.com>
 

6.4 minutes would indicate 1 worm cycle.

There are two possibilities. A nick in the worm or a defect in the worm wheel teeth. The test I suggested in my previous post will determine which one.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Hambrick via groups.io <mike.hambrick@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 2:45 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

What is the time interval of those spikes ? The intervals all look to be the same which definitely suggests a worm issue.


Best Regards

Michael Hambrick
ARLANXEO
TSR Global Manufacturing Support
PO Box 2000
Orange, TX 77631-2000
Phone: +1 (409) 882-2799
email: mike.hambrick@...


Ron Kramer
 

I don't own use a keypad.   I did try that SWAP OVER - but I then cleaned it and not sure where it ended up.  Since the last test clearly had the saime  KICKS. I can do ig again.  
What does that do?  I think it might track toward the other side of the groove?  I'll swap it over again and see if it helps since re-greasing.

NICELY - greasing lowered my RA RMA error almost 50%.  Here is my history.

Mount arrived. I guided around 1.0.  Always trying to tweak it - not sure why but months later I was guiding at  .24 RMS error (arc set). yeah - that's awesome.
MANY months of that... The RASA guided better than my long APO.  But late winter I swapped RASA V1 for a RASA V2 (heavier) and ever since my guiding was 1.5 average.  My image scale is 1.69 
lately - the RA kicks put me into  1.7-2.0.  I get double stars on every other sub. 
I re-greased the RA and last night afterwards I was 1.1max and usuall around .89 tot rms arc sec. (nice)  But the RA still kicks and makes for double stars.  My dec was still poor so I'll regrease dec next and check
my alignment. (it's fairly perminent in a dome, but I have a tripod leg/mount and it "can move".  I usually check alignment 1-2 times a year or when ever guiding quality decreases. 
I am not aware of any gear scraping - I always release it clean...  I have on 3-4 occasions allowed it to track into a leg and (stop). Not sure if that hurts anything. But seems to work fine next time.

I don't understand why the RA kick changed from lower to higher (E to W?) the mount orientation did not change. 
I'll swap the part positions over and try again tonight.  During regreasing/cleaning I saw nothing strange. No chunks or crud.  old Grease moved quickly,  freely. not at all gummy. 
I have some pics n video.



On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ron,

Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.

Can you do a test for me?

With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"

Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.

By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 


RA KICK.JPG

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.





On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
--


--


--




Ron Kramer
 

Capture is CLEAR and sharp. not sure what "GROUPS" does to images. I hate GROUPS.  Forums are better and allow you to retain/library of topics and Q&A, = (
I'll attach it again.  Is there a limit? size? restriction?    I'll attach at ORIGINAL SIZE


RA KICK.JPG

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 4:37 PM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I don't own use a keypad.   I did try that SWAP OVER - but I then cleaned it and not sure where it ended up.  Since the last test clearly had the saime  KICKS. I can do ig again.  
What does that do?  I think it might track toward the other side of the groove?  I'll swap it over again and see if it helps since re-greasing.

NICELY - greasing lowered my RA RMA error almost 50%.  Here is my history.

Mount arrived. I guided around 1.0.  Always trying to tweak it - not sure why but months later I was guiding at  .24 RMS error (arc set). yeah - that's awesome.
MANY months of that... The RASA guided better than my long APO.  But late winter I swapped RASA V1 for a RASA V2 (heavier) and ever since my guiding was 1.5 average.  My image scale is 1.69 
lately - the RA kicks put me into  1.7-2.0.  I get double stars on every other sub. 
I re-greased the RA and last night afterwards I was 1.1max and usuall around .89 tot rms arc sec. (nice)  But the RA still kicks and makes for double stars.  My dec was still poor so I'll regrease dec next and check
my alignment. (it's fairly perminent in a dome, but I have a tripod leg/mount and it "can move".  I usually check alignment 1-2 times a year or when ever guiding quality decreases. 
I am not aware of any gear scraping - I always release it clean...  I have on 3-4 occasions allowed it to track into a leg and (stop). Not sure if that hurts anything. But seems to work fine next time.

I don't understand why the RA kick changed from lower to higher (E to W?) the mount orientation did not change. 
I'll swap the part positions over and try again tonight.  During regreasing/cleaning I saw nothing strange. No chunks or crud.  old Grease moved quickly,  freely. not at all gummy. 
I have some pics n video.



On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ron,

Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.

Can you do a test for me?

With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"

Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.

By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 


RA KICK.JPG

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.





On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
--


--


--



--



uncarollo2 <chris1011@aol.com>
 

You can do the same thing using the ASCOM driver. Same routine as I described.

Roland



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 3:37 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I don't own use a keypad.   I did try that SWAP OVER - but I then cleaned it and not sure where it ended up.  Since the last test clearly had the saime  KICKS. I can do ig again.  
What does that do?  I think it might track toward the other side of the groove?  I'll swap it over again and see if it helps since re-greasing.

NICELY - greasing lowered my RA RMA error almost 50%.  Here is my history.

Mount arrived. I guided around 1.0.  Always trying to tweak it - not sure why but months later I was guiding at  .24 RMS error (arc set). yeah - that's awesome.
MANY months of that... The RASA guided better than my long APO.  But late winter I swapped RASA V1 for a RASA V2 (heavier) and ever since my guiding was 1.5 average.  My image scale is 1.69 
lately - the RA kicks put me into  1.7-2.0.  I get double stars on every other sub. 
I re-greased the RA and last night afterwards I was 1.1max and usuall around .89 tot rms arc sec. (nice)  But the RA still kicks and makes for double stars.  My dec was still poor so I'll regrease dec next and check
my alignment. (it's fairly perminent in a dome, but I have a tripod leg/mount and it "can move".  I usually check alignment 1-2 times a year or when ever guiding quality decreases. 
I am not aware of any gear scraping - I always release it clean...  I have on 3-4 occasions allowed it to track into a leg and (stop). Not sure if that hurts anything. But seems to work fine next time.

I don't understand why the RA kick changed from lower to higher (E to W?) the mount orientation did not change. 
I'll swap the part positions over and try again tonight.  During regreasing/cleaning I saw nothing strange. No chunks or crud.  old Grease moved quickly,  freely. not at all gummy. 
I have some pics n video.



On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ron,

Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.

Can you do a test for me?

With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"

Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.

By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 


RA KICK.JPG

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.





On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
--


--


--


--


uncarollo2 <chris1011@aol.com>
 

The graph shows 7 RA motions in the down direction, then a number of RA moves in the opposite direction. Is this over a period of time continuously? In other words, was this graph taken without interruption?

Roland



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

Capture is CLEAR and sharp. not sure what "GROUPS" does to images. I hate GROUPS.  Forums are better and allow you to retain/library of topics and Q&A, = (
I'll attach it again.  Is there a limit? size? restriction?    I'll attach at ORIGINAL SIZE


RA KICK.JPG

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 4:37 PM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I don't own use a keypad.   I did try that SWAP OVER - but I then cleaned it and not sure where it ended up.  Since the last test clearly had the saime  KICKS. I can do ig again.  
What does that do?  I think it might track toward the other side of the groove?  I'll swap it over again and see if it helps since re-greasing.

NICELY - greasing lowered my RA RMA error almost 50%.  Here is my history.

Mount arrived. I guided around 1.0.  Always trying to tweak it - not sure why but months later I was guiding at  .24 RMS error (arc set). yeah - that's awesome.
MANY months of that... The RASA guided better than my long APO.  But late winter I swapped RASA V1 for a RASA V2 (heavier) and ever since my guiding was 1.5 average.  My image scale is 1.69 
lately - the RA kicks put me into  1.7-2.0.  I get double stars on every other sub. 
I re-greased the RA and last night afterwards I was 1.1max and usuall around .89 tot rms arc sec. (nice)  But the RA still kicks and makes for double stars.  My dec was still poor so I'll regrease dec next and check
my alignment. (it's fairly perminent in a dome, but I have a tripod leg/mount and it "can move".  I usually check alignment 1-2 times a year or when ever guiding quality decreases. 
I am not aware of any gear scraping - I always release it clean...  I have on 3-4 occasions allowed it to track into a leg and (stop). Not sure if that hurts anything. But seems to work fine next time.

I don't understand why the RA kick changed from lower to higher (E to W?) the mount orientation did not change. 
I'll swap the part positions over and try again tonight.  During regreasing/cleaning I saw nothing strange. No chunks or crud.  old Grease moved quickly,  freely. not at all gummy. 
I have some pics n video.



On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ron,

Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.

Can you do a test for me?

With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"

Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.

By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 


RA KICK.JPG

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.





On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
--


--


--


--


--


 

those big offsets and changing directions look an awful lot like the spiral dither pattern in PHD


On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 2:11 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
The graph shows 7 RA motions in the down direction, then a number of RA moves in the opposite direction. Is this over a period of time continuously? In other words, was this graph taken without interruption?

Roland



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

Capture is CLEAR and sharp. not sure what "GROUPS" does to images. I hate GROUPS.  Forums are better and allow you to retain/library of topics and Q&A, = (
I'll attach it again.  Is there a limit? size? restriction?    I'll attach at ORIGINAL SIZE


RA KICK.JPG

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 4:37 PM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I don't own use a keypad.   I did try that SWAP OVER - but I then cleaned it and not sure where it ended up.  Since the last test clearly had the saime  KICKS. I can do ig again.  
What does that do?  I think it might track toward the other side of the groove?  I'll swap it over again and see if it helps since re-greasing.

NICELY - greasing lowered my RA RMA error almost 50%.  Here is my history.

Mount arrived. I guided around 1.0.  Always trying to tweak it - not sure why but months later I was guiding at  .24 RMS error (arc set). yeah - that's awesome.
MANY months of that... The RASA guided better than my long APO.  But late winter I swapped RASA V1 for a RASA V2 (heavier) and ever since my guiding was 1.5 average.  My image scale is 1.69 
lately - the RA kicks put me into  1.7-2.0.  I get double stars on every other sub. 
I re-greased the RA and last night afterwards I was 1.1max and usuall around .89 tot rms arc sec. (nice)  But the RA still kicks and makes for double stars.  My dec was still poor so I'll regrease dec next and check
my alignment. (it's fairly perminent in a dome, but I have a tripod leg/mount and it "can move".  I usually check alignment 1-2 times a year or when ever guiding quality decreases. 
I am not aware of any gear scraping - I always release it clean...  I have on 3-4 occasions allowed it to track into a leg and (stop). Not sure if that hurts anything. But seems to work fine next time.

I don't understand why the RA kick changed from lower to higher (E to W?) the mount orientation did not change. 
I'll swap the part positions over and try again tonight.  During regreasing/cleaning I saw nothing strange. No chunks or crud.  old Grease moved quickly,  freely. not at all gummy. 
I have some pics n video.



On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ron,

Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.

Can you do a test for me?

With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"

Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.

By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 


RA KICK.JPG

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.





On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
--


--


--


--


--



--
Brian 



Brian Valente


uncarollo2 <chris1011@aol.com>
 

That's interesting.
A gear defect can only occur every 6.4 minutes, never at some random time or at shorter or longer time periods. There was no answer as to what the time period was for each spike, and the graph time cannot be read. It woudl really be helpful to know the time period.

Rolando


-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Valente <bvalente@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 4:25 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

those big offsets and changing directions look an awful lot like the spiral dither pattern in PHD

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 2:11 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
The graph shows 7 RA motions in the down direction, then a number of RA moves in the opposite direction. Is this over a period of time continuously? In other words, was this graph taken without interruption?

Roland



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

Capture is CLEAR and sharp. not sure what "GROUPS" does to images. I hate GROUPS.  Forums are better and allow you to retain/library of topics and Q&A, = (
I'll attach it again.  Is there a limit? size? restriction?    I'll attach at ORIGINAL SIZE


RA KICK.JPG

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 4:37 PM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I don't own use a keypad.   I did try that SWAP OVER - but I then cleaned it and not sure where it ended up.  Since the last test clearly had the saime  KICKS. I can do ig again.  
What does that do?  I think it might track toward the other side of the groove?  I'll swap it over again and see if it helps since re-greasing.

NICELY - greasing lowered my RA RMA error almost 50%.  Here is my history.

Mount arrived. I guided around 1.0.  Always trying to tweak it - not sure why but months later I was guiding at  .24 RMS error (arc set). yeah - that's awesome.
MANY months of that... The RASA guided better than my long APO.  But late winter I swapped RASA V1 for a RASA V2 (heavier) and ever since my guiding was 1.5 average.  My image scale is 1.69 
lately - the RA kicks put me into  1.7-2.0.  I get double stars on every other sub. 
I re-greased the RA and last night afterwards I was 1.1max and usuall around .89 tot rms arc sec. (nice)  But the RA still kicks and makes for double stars.  My dec was still poor so I'll regrease dec next and check
my alignment. (it's fairly perminent in a dome, but I have a tripod leg/mount and it "can move".  I usually check alignment 1-2 times a year or when ever guiding quality decreases. 
I am not aware of any gear scraping - I always release it clean...  I have on 3-4 occasions allowed it to track into a leg and (stop). Not sure if that hurts anything. But seems to work fine next time.

I don't understand why the RA kick changed from lower to higher (E to W?) the mount orientation did not change. 
I'll swap the part positions over and try again tonight.  During regreasing/cleaning I saw nothing strange. No chunks or crud.  old Grease moved quickly,  freely. not at all gummy. 
I have some pics n video.



On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ron,

Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.

Can you do a test for me?

With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"

Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.

By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 


RA KICK.JPG

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.





On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
--


--


--


--


--


--
Brian 



Brian Valente


Worsel
 

Ron

You could provide logs same as on the PHD2 forum...just provide the link to the PHD2 server.

Bryan