Remote desktop software weird behavior


George LaBelle
 

The problem with RealVNC (free version) is that it is "Cloud" based only. I'd rather have a direct connect over local lan, mainly because I'm in a rural area (at 4,100 ft ;-) and ISP is over uW with data metering.

While I agree $100 for Win10Pro doesn't seem like much, there's still the danger and hassle of having to upgrade the whole OS. 

And the question wasn't answered - do you need Pro on both host and controller?


Ross Salinger <rgsalinger@...>
 

The "pro" upgrade just unlocks the features on my machine - it's a license upgrade, not a whole new OS. Double check me but I've done this a couple of times and that's my memory of the process.

I've used Teamviewer where there is no internet, just my own tiny router, and it worked just fine so I'm not sure that when used on a LAN that any data is flowing over to TV's servers.

Rgrds-Ross

On 8/13/2019 8:40 AM, george.labelle@... [ap-gto] wrote:
 

The problem with RealVNC (free version) is that it is "Cloud" based only. I'd rather have a direct connect over local lan, mainly because I'm in a rural area (at 4,100 ft ;-) and ISP is over uW with data metering.


While I agree $100 for Win10Pro doesn't seem like much, there's still the danger and hassle of having to upgrade the whole OS. 

And the question wasn't answered - do you need Pro on both host and controller?


Michael Fulbright <mike.fulbright@...>
 

I've used TightVNC for a decade plus with no sniffing/clouds/harassment.

Michael Fulbright

On 8/13/19 11:40 AM, george.labelle@... [ap-gto] wrote:
 

The problem with RealVNC (free version) is that it is "Cloud" based only. I'd rather have a direct connect over local lan, mainly because I'm in a rural area (at 4,100 ft ;-) and ISP is over uW with data metering.


While I agree $100 for Win10Pro doesn't seem like much, there's still the danger and hassle of having to upgrade the whole OS. 

And the question wasn't answered - do you need Pro on both host and controller?


Joe Zeglinski
 

Ross,
 
    I was wondering if the AI is collecting info and counting how many times an outside program is “providing support” to us as a non-commercial user. Then, when the count reaches a threshold of intolerance, your next use of a web browser, gives the TeamViewer local PC AI program to upload its stats to TV head office in Germany.
 
    If you never use the laptop to connect to the internet, then your idea of restricting TV use to the LAN might be fine. It may also require you to change the OPTIONS Setting  “Allow LAN connections” – to ACCEPT EXCLUSIVELY”. Otherwise, the bare “ACCEPT” option, still allows TV head office AI direct connection, even as you are restricting yourself to the LAN (inclusively), for the backyard telescope.
 
    One other thing I just discovered about TeamViewer Banishment.
It is still possible to use TV from a different PC in the house, to reach other ID numbers of family PC’s, since the other in-house TV has a different ID number. However, I found that “the person I was trying to reach” when I got hit, was also “tagged” by the TV AI sniffer, at the same time. That remote PC could login to my other PC and its TV, but I still could not login to the original remote session ID, even from a different PC. So, when the AI locks out the initiating PC, it also affects incoming TV connections on the remote PC – in effect harming two systems at the same time – the banned initiator/helper and the helped person at the other end, trying to be reached.
That (local ?) AI really is nasty.
 
Joe


Steve Reilly
 

So as expected I received an email from TV this morning :

 

Thank you very much for sending your self-declaration of personal use to us.
 
We have successfully reset the TeamViewer ID you submitted via the form provided earlier, and we acknowledge that you are using TeamViewer for personal use only.
 
With your signed declaration, we took additional steps to make sure your TeamViewer ID remains reset.”

 

 

And it goes on to say that it can be revoked if they detect commercial usage….

 

Steve

 

From: ap-gto@...
Sent: Tuesday, August 13, 2019 11:58 AM
To: ap-gto@...
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Re: Remote desktop software weird behavior

 

 

I've used TightVNC for a decade plus with no sniffing/clouds/harassment.

Michael Fulbright

On 8/13/19 11:40 AM, george.labelle@... [ap-gto] wrote:

 

The problem with RealVNC (free version) is that it is "Cloud" based only. I'd rather have a direct connect over local lan, mainly because I'm in a rural area (at 4,100 ft ;-) and ISP is over uW with data metering.

 

While I agree $100 for Win10Pro doesn't seem like much, there's still the danger and hassle of having to upgrade the whole OS. 

 

And the question wasn't answered - do you need Pro on both host and controller?

 


Joe Zeglinski
 

Hi Steve,
 
    Out  of curiosity - how long did it take between your filling out the TV claim form, until TeamViewer staff got around to re-instating you?
 
    Also, did you ever figure out how their AI program made its mistake in your use?
 
    I strongly suspect that in my case, it confused my Win-10 being logged into - with my permission - by Microsoft tech support investigating a problem I had reported. Four different members of their team used their commercial LogMeIn program for this, about 6 or 8 times over the course of two months, so maybe the TV AI app can’t distinguish between “incoming and outgoing initiations”  of such use, even by other competing programs. It just knows that “some business entity” was used in my PC. Perhaps that is why the Chat Line clerk asked me if I had ever used TeamViewer from an internet cafe, or even while visiting some business office, If so, then the AI is far too sensitive and doesn’t discriminate someone using TV in the field, while perhaps just waiting in a lobby  for an appointment.
In my case, neither was true – but Microsoft was permitted to control my PC, without restrictions.
 
    I also notice that perhaps in recent TV version updates, TeamViewer “Extras” option check marked setting to have TV drop back into the Win Task Bar when idle or closed down, “cannot be unchecked”, in the Free version. That setting is active and grayed out. This must be how their AI is sniffing on our PC activity, even when we are NOT logged in using TeamViewer. Very sneaky.
The paid versions wouldn’t need that option to always be on, and can be unchecked by such commercial users, since TeamViewer doesn’t care then.
 
    The other possibility is that (some) programs like LogMeIn (etc.) which compete with TV, may find TV on a customer’s PC, and “purposely leave” tell-tail trash behind,  of their “commercial login”,  for TV to discover and subsequently ban the Free user – thus rewarding themselves with a potential new customer for their own program app.
 
Joe
 

From: sreilly24590@... [ap-gto]
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 11:27 AM
To: ap-gto@...
Subject: RE: [ap-gto] Re: Remote desktop software weird behavior
So as expected I received an email from TV this morning :

Thank you very much for sending your self-declaration of personal use to us.
 
We have successfully reset the TeamViewer ID you submitted via the form provided earlier, and we acknowledge that you are using TeamViewer for personal use only.
 
With your signed declaration, we took additional steps to make sure your TeamViewer ID remains reset.”

And it goes on to say that it can be revoked if they detect commercial usage….

Steve


Ron Kramer
 

I got banished. I filled the form. I got a msg like yours that I was restored. (but when I run it - I still get the commercial warning). = (
There is another option FREE called   NOMACHINE.   in case. = ( 
I prefer remote desktop - it's higher res. But if drops out a lot. And I then revert to team viewer during those events.
My dome is 300 ft from the house as well.


On Thu, Aug 15, 2019 at 10:54 AM 'Joseph Zeglinski' J.Zeglinski@... [ap-gto] <ap-gto@...> wrote:
 

Hi Steve,
 
    Out  of curiosity - how long did it take between your filling out the TV claim form, until TeamViewer staff got around to re-instating you?
 
    Also, did you ever figure out how their AI program made its mistake in your use?
 
    I strongly suspect that in my case, it confused my Win-10 being logged into - with my permission - by Microsoft tech support investigating a problem I had reported. Four different members of their team used their commercial LogMeIn program for this, about 6 or 8 times over the course of two months, so maybe the TV AI app can’t distinguish between “incoming and outgoing initiations”  of such use, even by other competing programs. It just knows that “some business entity” was used in my PC.. Perhaps that is why the Chat Line clerk asked me if I had ever used TeamViewer from an internet cafe, or even while visiting some business office, If so, then the AI is far too sensitive and doesn’t discriminate someone using TV in the field, while perhaps just waiting in a lobby  for an appointment.
In my case, neither was true – but Microsoft was permitted to control my PC, without restrictions.
 
    I also notice that perhaps in recent TV version updates, TeamViewer “Extras” option check marked setting to have TV drop back into the Win Task Bar when idle or closed down, “cannot be unchecked”, in the Free version. That setting is active and grayed out. This must be how their AI is sniffing on our PC activity, even when we are NOT logged in using TeamViewer. Very sneaky.
The paid versions wouldn’t need that option to always be on, and can be unchecked by such commercial users, since TeamViewer doesn’t care then.
 
    The other possibility is that (some) programs like LogMeIn (etc.) which compete with TV, may find TV on a customer’s PC, and “purposely leave” tell-tail trash behind,  of their “commercial login”,  for TV to discover and subsequently ban the Free user – thus rewarding themselves with a potential new customer for their own program app.
 
Joe
 
From: sreilly24590@... [ap-gto]
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 11:27 AM
To: ap-gto@...
Subject: RE: [ap-gto] Re: Remote desktop software weird behavior
So as expected I received an email from TV this morning :

Thank you very much for sending your self-declaration of personal use to us.
 
We have successfully reset the TeamViewer ID you submitted via the form provided earlier, and we acknowledge that you are using TeamViewer for personal use only.
 
With your signed declaration, we took additional steps to make sure your TeamViewer ID remains reset.”

And it goes on to say that it can be revoked if they detect commercial usage….

Steve




Ron Kramer
 

Time to be restored - seems like it was 3 weeks?  (TV restored after commercial notice)  however - though I recieved the email I was restored. I still get a warning that says I'll be disconnected shortly.


On Thu, Aug 29, 2019 at 8:38 PM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I got banished. I filled the form. I got a msg like yours that I was restored. (but when I run it - I still get the commercial warning). = (
There is another option FREE called   NOMACHINE.   in case. = ( 
I prefer remote desktop - it's higher res. But if drops out a lot. And I then revert to team viewer during those events.
My dome is 300 ft from the house as well.


On Thu, Aug 15, 2019 at 10:54 AM 'Joseph Zeglinski' J.Zeglinski@... [ap-gto] <ap-gto@...> wrote:
 

Hi Steve,
 
    Out  of curiosity - how long did it take between your filling out the TV claim form, until TeamViewer staff got around to re-instating you?
 
    Also, did you ever figure out how their AI program made its mistake in your use?
 
    I strongly suspect that in my case, it confused my Win-10 being logged into - with my permission - by Microsoft tech support investigating a problem I had reported. Four different members of their team used their commercial LogMeIn program for this, about 6 or 8 times over the course of two months, so maybe the TV AI app can’t distinguish between “incoming and outgoing initiations”  of such use, even by other competing programs. It just knows that “some business entity” was used in my PC.. Perhaps that is why the Chat Line clerk asked me if I had ever used TeamViewer from an internet cafe, or even while visiting some business office, If so, then the AI is far too sensitive and doesn’t discriminate someone using TV in the field, while perhaps just waiting in a lobby  for an appointment.
In my case, neither was true – but Microsoft was permitted to control my PC, without restrictions.
 
    I also notice that perhaps in recent TV version updates, TeamViewer “Extras” option check marked setting to have TV drop back into the Win Task Bar when idle or closed down, “cannot be unchecked”, in the Free version. That setting is active and grayed out. This must be how their AI is sniffing on our PC activity, even when we are NOT logged in using TeamViewer. Very sneaky.
The paid versions wouldn’t need that option to always be on, and can be unchecked by such commercial users, since TeamViewer doesn’t care then.
 
    The other possibility is that (some) programs like LogMeIn (etc.) which compete with TV, may find TV on a customer’s PC, and “purposely leave” tell-tail trash behind,  of their “commercial login”,  for TV to discover and subsequently ban the Free user – thus rewarding themselves with a potential new customer for their own program app.
 
Joe
 
From: sreilly24590@... [ap-gto]
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 11:27 AM
To: ap-gto@...
Subject: RE: [ap-gto] Re: Remote desktop software weird behavior
So as expected I received an email from TV this morning :

Thank you very much for sending your self-declaration of personal use to us.
 
We have successfully reset the TeamViewer ID you submitted via the form provided earlier, and we acknowledge that you are using TeamViewer for personal use only.
 
With your signed declaration, we took additional steps to make sure your TeamViewer ID remains reset.”

And it goes on to say that it can be revoked if they detect commercial usage….

Steve



--



Ron Kramer
 

They were saying   ME OR A CONTACT  is using it commercially?  Has AP signed up to use it commercially?  Though I haven't had Horward connect up in over a year. I wonder if he was flagged and those he's connected to?
I just was clicking around teamviewer to see if I could reset it and found  "contacts from recent sessions" list which includes  Howard4AP. 
?

On Thu, Aug 15, 2019 at 10:54 AM 'Joseph Zeglinski' J.Zeglinski@... [ap-gto] <ap-gto@...> wrote:
 

Hi Steve,
 
    Out  of curiosity - how long did it take between your filling out the TV claim form, until TeamViewer staff got around to re-instating you?
 
    Also, did you ever figure out how their AI program made its mistake in your use?
 
    I strongly suspect that in my case, it confused my Win-10 being logged into - with my permission - by Microsoft tech support investigating a problem I had reported. Four different members of their team used their commercial LogMeIn program for this, about 6 or 8 times over the course of two months, so maybe the TV AI app can’t distinguish between “incoming and outgoing initiations”  of such use, even by other competing programs. It just knows that “some business entity” was used in my PC.. Perhaps that is why the Chat Line clerk asked me if I had ever used TeamViewer from an internet cafe, or even while visiting some business office, If so, then the AI is far too sensitive and doesn’t discriminate someone using TV in the field, while perhaps just waiting in a lobby  for an appointment.
In my case, neither was true – but Microsoft was permitted to control my PC, without restrictions.
 
    I also notice that perhaps in recent TV version updates, TeamViewer “Extras” option check marked setting to have TV drop back into the Win Task Bar when idle or closed down, “cannot be unchecked”, in the Free version. That setting is active and grayed out. This must be how their AI is sniffing on our PC activity, even when we are NOT logged in using TeamViewer. Very sneaky.
The paid versions wouldn’t need that option to always be on, and can be unchecked by such commercial users, since TeamViewer doesn’t care then.
 
    The other possibility is that (some) programs like LogMeIn (etc.) which compete with TV, may find TV on a customer’s PC, and “purposely leave” tell-tail trash behind,  of their “commercial login”,  for TV to discover and subsequently ban the Free user – thus rewarding themselves with a potential new customer for their own program app.
 
Joe
 
From: sreilly24590@... [ap-gto]
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 11:27 AM
To: ap-gto@...
Subject: RE: [ap-gto] Re: Remote desktop software weird behavior
So as expected I received an email from TV this morning :

Thank you very much for sending your self-declaration of personal use to us.
 
We have successfully reset the TeamViewer ID you submitted via the form provided earlier, and we acknowledge that you are using TeamViewer for personal use only.
 
With your signed declaration, we took additional steps to make sure your TeamViewer ID remains reset.”

And it goes on to say that it can be revoked if they detect commercial usage….

Steve




david w pearson
 

for those who got reinstated with teamviewer you were fortunate!   I got completely banned!   My use was talking to my telescope in another state.   after 5 months of usage i got the commercial message....I never got 5 minutes of use after receiving the message, it was like 2 minutes or less.  after filling out form and sending it in, i got a response after about 8-9 days.
I was banned because i was told that the personal version is for family and friends only.     I did response pointing out that according to their website, family and friends only was only one of several usages allowed for the teamviewer personal version.    Haven't heard anything back.    I had google remote desktop as my backup.    but after switching to it, they had updated remote desktop calling it remote desktop web app.   seems that internet speeds needed to be above some value, because it didn't connect up very often.   so i went to remote PC.  i have been using for a week or two....and no issues.
dave

On Thursday, August 29, 2019, 05:46:29 PM PDT, Ron Kramer ronkramer1957@... [ap-gto] wrote:


 

They were saying   ME OR A CONTACT  is using it commercially?  Has AP signed up to use it commercially?  Though I haven't had Horward connect up in over a year. I wonder if he was flagged and those he's connected to?
I just was clicking around teamviewer to see if I could reset it and found  "contacts from recent sessions" list which includes  Howard4AP. 
?

On Thu, Aug 15, 2019 at 10:54 AM 'Joseph Zeglinski' J.Zeglinski@... [ap-gto] <ap-gto@...> wrote:
 

Hi Steve,
 
    Out  of curiosity - how long did it take between your filling out the TV claim form, until TeamViewer staff got around to re-instating you?
 
    Also, did you ever figure out how their AI program made its mistake in your use?
 
    I strongly suspect that in my case, it confused my Win-10 being logged into - with my permission - by Microsoft tech support investigating a problem I had reported. Four different members of their team used their commercial LogMeIn program for this, about 6 or 8 times over the course of two months, so maybe the TV AI app can’t distinguish between “incoming and outgoing initiations”  of such use, even by other competing programs. It just knows that “some business entity” was used in my PC... Perhaps that is why the Chat Line clerk asked me if I had ever used TeamViewer from an internet cafe, or even while visiting some business office, If so, then the AI is far too sensitive and doesn’t discriminate someone using TV in the field, while perhaps just waiting in a lobby  for an appointment.
In my case, neither was true – but Microsoft was permitted to control my PC, without restrictions.
 
    I also notice that perhaps in recent TV version updates, TeamViewer “Extras” option check marked setting to have TV drop back into the Win Task Bar when idle or closed down, “cannot be unchecked”, in the Free version. That setting is active and grayed out. This must be how their AI is sniffing on our PC activity, even when we are NOT logged in using TeamViewer. Very sneaky.
The paid versions wouldn’t need that option to always be on, and can be unchecked by such commercial users, since TeamViewer doesn’t care then.
 
    The other possibility is that (some) programs like LogMeIn (etc.) which compete with TV, may find TV on a customer’s PC, and “purposely leave” tell-tail trash behind,  of their “commercial login”,  for TV to discover and subsequently ban the Free user – thus rewarding themselves with a potential new customer for their own program app.
 
Joe
 
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 11:27 AM
Subject: RE: [ap-gto] Re: Remote desktop software weird behavior
So as expected I received an email from TV this morning :

Thank you very much for sending your self-declaration of personal use to us.
 
We have successfully reset the TeamViewer ID you submitted via the form provided earlier, and we acknowledge that you are using TeamViewer for personal use only.
 
With your signed declaration, we took additional steps to make sure your TeamViewer ID remains reset.”

And it goes on to say that it can be revoked if they detect commercial usage….

Steve



--


B Briggs
 

If I may be so bold as to ask a question about remote control of the desk top computer in the observatory.  I have a 'warm room' about 50 feet from the observatory and wish to connect two desk top computers-one in the warm room and the other in the observatory via hard wire.  (I do not have internet that is reliable or LAN in either location) . Can this be done via direct hard wire between the two , or do I have to run/bury a cat 5 cable 250 feet from my router in the house?  Thanks for any suggestions.
Burton


Joe Zeglinski
 

Hi Burton,
 
    Actually, your 50 feet separation has a simple solution – the “Power Line LAN”. Your observatory warm room gets its power from the house. Plug in a power line receiver in any outlet in the warm room, then use a standard Ethernet cable from it to your laptop that controls the scope. In the house, plug in a similar unit(s), into the AC outlet next to the modem/router, (even  a third one in any room in the house for your home computer) – or let it join the house link using Wifi to the router or its nearby power line transmitter.
 
    As long as the observatory warm room, gets its AC supplied the “same side” of the house fuse panel, you can have all the PC’s communicate over the home’s AC power lines. The 220 volts that come to your house fuse panel,  has two hot power lines ( a red one and a black one), which are split between  left side of the fuse box and right side of the fuse box. The router in the house and its nearby AC outlet for the power line transmitter, must share that SAME side with the observatory outlets, It is probably the simplest and least expensive solution for a home observatory LAN arrangement.
 
    I suggest a visit to a PC store, like Best Buy, to discuss these “AC power line modems”. Nice thing is that they are not affected by signal drop outs due to bad weather or nearby microwave ovens, garage door openers, baby room monitors, or cordless phones, etc. However, their signal is not that fast. I suppose if someone started up some heavy machinery, like a lathe in the basement, that might scramble the power line modem signalling, but I haven’t heard of it.
 
Joe


B Briggs
 

Thank you Joe for that suggestion.  The problem is the warm room and obs. and barn are on a different Idaho Power transformer than the house.  Will visit Best Buy as you suggest and 'pick their brains'/
Burton