Date
1 - 12 of 12
Mount does not stop Update
Dean Salman <cluster@...>
This is now serious problem. I have changed power supplies and there
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seems to be no issue with the gears. The software in the mount is 4.0x, is that the problem. This happens at any speed including 1x and both axis. I do know someone with a 1200 mount near by so I guess I can change out parts but this is looking like a mount issue, not the control box or key pad.
--- In ap-gto@..., "Dean Salman" <cluster@...> wrote:
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tucstargzr
Dean,
I'm new to the Goto mounts, but a few days ago http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/ap-gto/message/18896 Did you ever verify which version you're using? Current is 4.12. The software version scrolls immediately after powerup. Dowload from AP the Keypad_V412.pdf, and then the flash update. On page 11 and 12 of the Keypad instruction manual it details the fixes (top of page 12 mentions "N-S-E-W buttons will work correctly") Hope this helps. Tom --- In ap-gto@..., "Dean Salman" <cluster@...> wrote: there seems to be no issue with the gears. The software in the mount isand both axis. I do know someone with a 1200 mount near by so I guessI can change out parts but this is looking like a mount issue, notthe control box or key pad.so I didhave to press stop. I thought it was the key pad but PulseGuide thethe same thing without the keypad. Someone told me it was in controler box. So far I have not seen this using the Sky or CCD
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Dean Salman <cluster@...>
Yes, I was going to do this but the page says there is a password so
I have to call AP and give them my serial number to get it. I hope that works --- In ap-gto@..., "tucstargzr" <tucstargzr@...> wrote: fixes (top of page 12 mentions "N-S-E-W buttons will work correctly")is 1x4.0x, is that the problem. This happens at any speed including andguessboth axis. I do know someone with a 1200 mount near by so I Islewcan change out parts but this is looking like a mount issue, notthecontrol box or key pad. so IPulseGuidehave to press stop. I thought it was the key pad but didCCDthethe same thing without the keypad. Someone told me it was incontroler box. So far I have not seen this using the Sky or Commander. Anyway thoughts ?
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Roland Christen
In a message dated 8/12/2007 2:03:09 PM Central Daylight Time,
cluster@... writes: This is now serious problem. I have changed power supplies and thereI assume you have spoken with Howard and he told you that it is a servo control problem - specifically the microchip inside the servo controller. I also assume that you will be sending the servo control box in to have it fixed? Rolando ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
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Dean Salman <cluster@...>
Yes, he said I need to start replacing someone these, the first is
putting in the E1. I am also going to try another set of Y cables and a power supply that puts out 15v. The previous owner did not see this issue, so it could even be the serial ports themself. At this point he said nothing about sending anything in yet, I think we are in the trouble shooting stage. --- In ap-gto@..., chris1011@... wrote: there andseems to be no issue with the gears. The software in the mount is Iboth axis. I do know someone with a 1200 mount near by so I guess thecan change out parts but this is looking like a mount issue, not servocontrol box or key pad.I assume you have spoken with Howard and he told you that it is a control problem - specifically the microchip inside the servocontroller. I also assume that you will be sending the servo control box in to have itfixed?
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Hi Dean and Group,
I spoke with Dean about the issue this morning, and I thought that I should make a few trouble-shooting comments to the group as a whole. * We always recommend that you have the latest firmware versions installed on your keypad. The current version, v.4.12 has been a very stable and trouble free version. It has fixed any bugs that were in previous versions. For any of you who have not yet upgraded, I suggest you do so. Unlike some other software company who shall remain nameless, our latest version really is better, and it's free! Likewise, it is always a good idea to have the current version ROM chip installed in your GTOCPx servo control box. These chips aren't free, but they are very reasonable, and are relatively easy to upgrade. * When you are having a problem with your electronics, it is always a good idea to start with simple solutions first. Verify your power supply. Verify the integrity of your cables. Make sure you have good connections and that contacts are clean and free of oxidation. Intermittent or inadequate power can cause all sorts of strange behavior in servo control electronics, and poor connections can interrupt or corrupt communication between various components in a system. * Be sure that you don't have a mechanical issue. This mainly means be sure that your motors can turn the worm. Check this by turning the spur gear as Roland has outlined many times to this group. * The motors in the servo drive system must be fed voltage by the servo system to operate. Although there is a very sophisticated control system involving communication from the motors' encoders back to the servo, back to the motors etc., the motors or the mount cannot demand power or "suck" voltage from the system. They can only turn if the servo logic decides to feed them the necessary electrons. If they are turning when they shouldn't, it is because they are being fed voltage when they shouldn't. The question is why are they being fed? * There are really only two possibilities here. (I left out operator error since I have full confidence that Dean can press and release a direction button!! ;-) Either the servo is being instructed to feed the motors by erroneous instructions from the keypad or computer, or else the servo is erroneously feeding voltage to the motors without being told to do so. In this particular case, we had the problem showing up both when the keypad was giving the instructions to the servo and when PulseGuide was giving the instructions via an external computer. Since it is highly unlikely that both the keypad and PulseGuide would develop the exact same bug at exactly the same time, we are focusing attention on the GTOCP2 servo control box. * We decided to start by checking out all the items noted in the first three bullets above and by upgrading the ROM chip to the latest version - the "E1" for his GTOCP2. The chip upgrade was something Dean could do himself, and it was a recommended item anyway. Hopefully, replacing the chip will cure the servo. If the problem does persist, we will have eliminated most of the potential culprits making the repair job here at Astro-Physics much easier (and therefore hopefully a bit cheaper too!). This has been a rather long narrative, but I thought it might be instructive for you to see how the problem was approached. Any of you who follow the group will have seen the posts and will know what has been going on. I will provide a (much shorter) follow up when Dean's mount is performing flawlessly again. Mag. 7 skies! Howard Hedlund Astro-Physics, Inc. 815-282-1513 ________________________________ From: ap-gto@... [mailto:ap-gto@...] On Behalf Of Dean Salman Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2007 2:03 PM To: ap-gto@... Subject: [ap-gto] Re: Mount does not stop Update This is now serious problem. I have changed power supplies and there seems to be no issue with the gears. The software in the mount is 4.0x, is that the problem. This happens at any speed including 1x and both axis. I do know someone with a 1200 mount near by so I guess I can change out parts but this is looking like a mount issue, not the control box or key pad. --- In ap-gto@... <mailto:ap-gto%40yahoogroups.com> , "Dean Salman" <cluster@...> wrote:
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Dean Salman <cluster@...>
Hi Howard,
I upgraded to the version 4.12 but before doing that moved Pulse guide on the top serial port and the Sky on the bottom. I connected Pulse Guide and then the sky. Issue still occurred. I was thinking how the previous owner had no issue BUT, he was using only one cable. So I disconnected the 2nd cable and used only one. I can only connect TheSky or Pulse Guide one at a time, however, the problem went away including with the key pad. So I shut everything off and tried again with 2 cables and problem was back. So I swicth cables using one cable only and issue was gone. So this only happens when I have 2 cables connected. A storm moved in so I need to let it pass. Now it is time to remove the connector and put each cable on its own USB/Serial (the one I had before was 2 ports on one USB.) Still puzzled why this affects the key pad but it does. I can't break it with one cable, although a full nights use is the main test. I did use the 2 port serial programming the key pad and had no issue, so my guess is the mount does not like 2 serial ports that move the mount. Does anyone else have Pulse guide and TheSky setup on 2 serial cables and can slew everywhere with pulse guide or the keypad. Again, the issue is when you hold the button down on either pulse guide or the keypad for at least 20 seconds and let go, it usually keeps slewing. It is possible that the com port is not setting the state to off when the button is release, I know the things are pickly. At this point my work around is to use one cable. but I will still switch cables and USB/serial to see if one of those are an issue. Howard and the AP staff offer fantastic support. I did order the E1 chip as well --- In ap-gto@..., "Howard" <howard@...> wrote: whole.
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astrokattner
Dean,
I have the SKY6 and Pulseguide working on both serial ports, but I run both serial cables to a 4 port serial to usb converter and then to my laptop. Never have seen this problem. I have a late model Ap900. --- In ap-gto@..., "Dean Salman" <cluster@...> wrote: connected Pulse Guide and then the sky. Issue still occurred. I wasthinking how the previous owner had no issue BUT, he was using only oneswicth cables using one cable only and issue was gone. So this onlyhappens when I have 2 cables connected.remove the connector and put each cable on its own USB/Serial (the one Ihad before was 2 ports on one USB.) Still puzzled why this affects thecables and can slew everywhere with pulse guide or the keypad.when the button is release, I know the things are pickly. At this pointE1 chip as wellthat I should make a few trouble-shooting comments to the group as awhole.
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sreilly <sreilly@...>
Dean,
How is TheSky configured? Are you using the ASCOM or native driver? I can see where conflicts can occur if TheSky is connected via native and Pulse Guide by ASCOM. The proper way to connect would be via a ASCOM telescope hub. I use ACP as the direct control of the telescope and TheSky with the ASCOM TeleAPI, Pulse Guide and MaxImDl. Other than ACP, all other telescope connects are "ACP Telescope Hub". This way all commands are issued directly to the mount via ACP. All other programs talk to the mount by communicating through ACP. Steve _____ From: ap-gto@... [mailto:ap-gto@...] On Behalf Of astrokattner Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2007 1:36 AM To: ap-gto@... Subject: [ap-gto] Re: Mount does not stop Update Dean, I have the SKY6 and Pulseguide working on both serial ports, but I run both serial cables to a 4 port serial to usb converter and then to my laptop. Never have seen this problem. I have a late model Ap900. --- In ap-gto@yahoogroups. <mailto:ap-gto%40yahoogroups.com> com, "Dean Salman" <cluster@...> wrote: connected Pulse Guide and then the sky. Issue still occurred. I wasthinking how the previous owner had no issue BUT, he was using only oneswicth cables using one cable only and issue was gone. So this onlyhappens when I have 2 cables connected.remove the connector and put each cable on its own USB/Serial (the one Ihad before was 2 ports on one USB.) Still puzzled why this affects thecables and can slew everywhere with pulse guide or the keypad.when the button is release, I know the things are pickly. At this pointE1 chip as well<howard@> wrote: that I should make a few trouble-shooting comments to the group as awhole.
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Roland Christen
There are two sets of software, the one in the keypad and the one in the
servo controller. These two are separate from each other and stand alone from each other. Version 4.12 is the keypad software, but this has no effect whatsoever on the action between the servo controller and other external command software such as Pulse Guide and TheSky6. If the servo controller is not responding to external commands, it might be because it is being overloaded with requests (such as position requests from The Sky6). This was a weakness in very early software and was fixed in later versions of the servo control software (not to be confused with the Keypad V4.12 software). I asked Mike, our development engineer, and here is what he said: Very early versions of firmware occasionally dropped com port characters if the com ports kept the mount very busy. I do not recall which version introduced the fixes. But I recall dealing with Bob Denny, Ray Gralak, and a couple others on this. Bob e-mailed us "Port Mon" sessions that showed dropped commands. We also replicated issues with the mount dropping move/stop commands from the keypad until the software was fixed. The reason the keypad is affected is because there were brief periods of time that the controller was busy processing commands from other ports while the interrupts were disabled. If the controller is "out to lunch" longer than two characters (2.3mS), one character could be ignored, which could make the entire command unrecognizable and therefore lost. Marj might have records that show what firmware versions introduces the fixes to these problems, we recently discussed revision history of the world. Otherwise I can look it up later tonight. If he is ordering an E1 chip, he must have a GTOCP2. I do not recall these problems with the GTOCP2, but a new chip is the next logical step. -Mike Therefore it appears that your mount has some very old version of servo control software which had problems handling more than 1 input from external programs. We have basically solved this in later chips, so hopefully this will go away when you receive the new chip. This is also something that others should be aware of if they have purchased a used mount from another individual. It would be a good idea to check the chip set that is in the servo (easily done by removing the cover plate), as well as checking the keypad software version. Updating everything is not expensive and can avoid headaches like the ones in this post. Roland Christen In a message dated 8/14/2007 12:14:14 AM Central Daylight Time, cluster@... writes: Hi Howard, ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
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Dean Salman <cluster@...>
Thanks for letting me know. I suspect that there is come kind of
configuation issue somewhere. I was almost certain that there was no issue with the mount itself because of the way the mount was treated in an observatory home and because it guides perfect as well as slews in the Sky. I did a couple of e-mails from others with issues using 2 cables, not sure if it was the exact issue, but they gave up on the 2 cables as well. I have kind of given up on have both connected because there really is no reason for me to do this now that I have CCD Commander and plate solveing down. I just need to use pulse guide to initialize the mount and that is about it. What I do is start from Park 1 and run a CCD Commander script to move to a star, right now Deneb, and plate solve. Then sync on the sky. It can't be any easier than that I have to say. The 4.12 upgrade did fix an issue in the park I was having and the upgrade was so easy that I recommend anyone to do that. AP made just about the best software I have seen to do this and being a software developer, that should say a lot. Dean --- In ap-gto@..., "sreilly" <sreilly@...> wrote: I can see where conflicts can occur if TheSky is connected via native andPulse Guide by ASCOM. The proper way to connect would be via a ASCOMtelescope hub. I use ACP as the direct control of the telescope and TheSkywith the ASCOM TeleAPI, Pulse Guide and MaxImDl. Other than ACP, all othertelescope connects are "ACP Telescope Hub". This way all commands are issueddirectly to the mount via ACP. All other programs talk to the mount bycommunicating through ACP.Behalf Of astrokattnercom, "Dean Salman" <cluster@> wrote:everythingconnected theoff and tried again with 2 cables and problem was back. So Iswicthcables using one cable only and issue was gone. So this onlyhappenswhen I have 2 cables connected.remove mountkey pad but it does. I can't break it with one cable, although a usuallydoes not like 2 serial ports that move the mount.cables pointkeeps slewing.when cablesmy work around is to use one cable. but I will still switch com, "Howard"and USB/serial to see if one of those are an issue.E1 <howard@> wrote:that I
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Dean Salman <cluster@...>
I do plan on updating all the chips needed, I think there is a Max
chip or something Howard told me about. I was in line with a new one but got a good deal for this one, so spending some cash for the latest stuff is something I do not mind. --- In ap-gto@..., chris1011@... wrote: in the servo controller. These two are separate from each other and standalone from each other. Version 4.12 is the keypad software, but this has no effectwhatsoever on the action between the servo controller and other externalcommand software such as Pulse Guide and TheSky6.might be because it is being overloaded with requests (such as positionrequests from The Sky6). This was a weakness in very early software and was fixedin later versions of the servo control software (not to be confused with theKeypad V4.12 software). I asked Mike, our development engineer, and here is whathe said: characters if the com ports kept the mount very busy. I do not recall whichversion introduced the fixes. But I recall dealing with Bob Denny, RayGralak, and a couple others on this. Bob e-mailed us "Port Mon" sessions that showeddropped commands. We also replicated issues with the mount droppingmove/stop commands from the keypad until the software was fixed. The reason the keypad isaffected is because there were brief periods of time that the controller wasbusy processing commands from other ports while the interrupts weredisabled. If the controller is "out to lunch" longer than two characters (2.3mS),one character could be ignored, which could make the entire commandunrecognizable and therefore lost.the fixes to these problems, we recently discussed revision history of theworld. Otherwise I can look it up later tonight.recall these problems with the GTOCP2, but a new chip is the next logical step.servo control software which had problems handling more than 1 input fromexternal programs. We have basically solved this in later chips, sohopefully this will go away when you receive the new chip.purchased a used mount from another individual. It would be a good idea tocheck the chip set that is in the servo (easily done by removing the coverplate), as well as checking the keypad software version. Updating everything is notexpensive and can avoid headaches like the ones in this post.connected thinkingPulse Guide and then the sky. Issue still occurred. I was everythinghow the previous owner had no issue BUT, he was using only one swicthoff and tried again with 2 cables and problem was back. So I happenscables using one cable only and issue was gone. So this only removewhen I have 2 cables connected. hadthe connector and put each cable on its own USB/Serial (the one I thebefore was 2 ports on one USB.) Still puzzled why this affects mountkey pad but it does. I can't break it with one cable, although a cablesdoes not like 2 serial ports that move the mount. usuallyand can slew everywhere with pulse guide or the keypad. whenkeeps slewing. pointthe button is release, I know the things are pickly. At this cablesmy work around is to use one cable. but I will still switch E1and USB/serial to see if one of those are an issue. chip as well
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