Date   

Re: What is the diameter and thread on the Pasil.4 polar scope?

Christopher Erickson
 

Speaking as a hybrid hobbyist/professional machinist, I would add that threading can be one of the trickier machining efforts to get right. Especially when you are going to be making two different threads that you are going to want to have very accurate in reference to each other and with the shoulder that the polar scope is going to seat against. And threading up tight to a shoulder is tricky and usually requires a modified threading tool. Testing the fit of the threads on the mount and the polar scope will also be tricky because you will most likely have to remove the part from the chuck and then replace it and re-register it with the threading tool. If you have a compound slide combined with a big illuminated magnifying glass, that can help to get the threading tool re-registered with the partially-cut threads when re-mounting the part in the chuck. However getting the piece precisely-square in the chuck again (.001") isn't trivial at all. I assume you have a dial-micrometer or something with a magnetic base.

On my (German) Prazi lathe which does not have split carriage nuts, I made a manual drive handle that allows me to manually turn threads at a slow rate, which gives me a very precise feel and ability to stop the tool at precise positions. And no risk of over-driving the cutter and ruining the part or breaking the threading tool. YMMV.

If you get the two threads and the outside shoulder even slightly out of square with each other (more than .001" and .1 degree), you will create problems and inaccuracies for yourself when mounting the polar scope on the mount. You will be able to adjust the PASILL polar scope to compensate for pointing errors in one position but when you rotate the polar scope, your alignment will go out. And the tiny PASILL alignment set screws are in direct contact with the glass reticle. Over-tighten them even a tiny amount and you crack the glass. You don't want any play but even the slightest over-tightening will likely ruin the reticle.

This sounds like a challenging but potentially-fun project however you are still going to want to perform a careful drift alignment with the mount so you can accurately test, align and evaluate your machined adapter. And if your goal is to only use this thing once (or once a season) for a permanent polar alignment of a mount on a pier, I really don't see where you will be gaining much from this project, except honing your budding machining skills.

And no matter which way you go, you are still going to have to perform a careful drift alignment if you want to do some serious astrophotography. Even if you invested in an official AP polar scope bushing adapter.

Depending on your mount threads, I might have 3 or more of these adapters in one of my spare-parts boxes and I could simply mail you one.

I hope this helps.

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 10:31 AM Tom Blahovici <tom.va2fsq@...> wrote:
Sounds like I my have to rethink this...I certainly didn't think about having to try it and reposition it in the lathe.
I guess I will need some practice.
Thanks


Re: Do-it-yourself battery replacement in 'new' keypad vs have AP do it ? (Cost ?)

Roland Christen
 


the procedure to replace the new keypad battery seems 'more tricky'.
Just plug your keypad into the CP controller, turn power on. Now you can replace the battery and you won't lose any of the memory data.

Rolando


-----Original Message-----
From: drgert1 via groups.io <drgert1@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Fri, Jun 19, 2020 4:23 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Do-it-yourself battery replacement in 'new' keypad vs have AP do it ? (Cost ?)

Hello All,

I need to replace the keypad battery for my AP900 mount.The keypad is the 'newer' model (with resp. to being from AP900 a few years back when it was still offered) I've seen the symptoms as corrupted messier objects DB (magnitude 100). I have serviced two AP1200 mounts for our club and club members. Both where the 'older' model with the cr1632 (3V) battery.

I wasn't aware that there are two variants of the keypad, grabbed my printed instructions from the work at the AP1200s and went right to work. Got confused about the inside of the keypad. Soon realized that I erroneously removed the clock battery. Replaced it. Tried the keypad and time/date was still good. Does the clock chip has some emergency run-time? Could I have damaged something else? Functionality of keypad looks normal (Other than not (yet) having replaced the DB battery? )

The DB battery reads 0.4V. Way out of spec (3V)! So needs replacement.

Going back to AP docs, the procedure to replace the new keypad battery seems 'more tricky'.

1. Have some of you folks gone through the replacement procedure (new keypad) yourself? (Any issues?)
2. I am contemplating sending the keypad to AP and have them do it. Maybe they can do the clock battery and clean connectors at the same time.  (Did some if you do the same? What additional cost?)

Thanks & Clear Skies,
Gert


Re: Do-it-yourself battery replacement in 'new' keypad vs have AP do it ? (Cost ?)

George
 

Gert,

 

Please reference the following:

https://astro-physics.info/tech_support/mounts/keypad/keypad-maintenance-instructions.pdf

 

Regards,

 

George

 

George Whitney

Astro-Physics, Inc.

Phone:  815-282-1513

Email:  george@...

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of drgert1 via groups.io
Sent: Friday, June 19, 2020 4:23 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: [ap-gto] Do-it-yourself battery replacement in 'new' keypad vs have AP do it ? (Cost ?)

 

Hello All,

I need to replace the keypad battery for my AP900 mount.The keypad is the 'newer' model (with resp. to being from AP900 a few years back when it was still offered) I've seen the symptoms as corrupted messier objects DB (magnitude 100). I have serviced two AP1200 mounts for our club and club members. Both where the 'older' model with the cr1632 (3V) battery.

I wasn't aware that there are two variants of the keypad, grabbed my printed instructions from the work at the AP1200s and went right to work. Got confused about the inside of the keypad. Soon realized that I erroneously removed the clock battery. Replaced it. Tried the keypad and time/date was still good. Does the clock chip has some emergency run-time? Could I have damaged something else? Functionality of keypad looks normal (Other than not (yet) having replaced the DB battery? )

The DB battery reads 0.4V. Way out of spec (3V)! So needs replacement.

Going back to AP docs, the procedure to replace the new keypad battery seems 'more tricky'.

1. Have some of you folks gone through the replacement procedure (new keypad) yourself? (Any issues?)
2. I am contemplating sending the keypad to AP and have them do it. Maybe they can do the clock battery and clean connectors at the same time.  (Did some if you do the same? What additional cost?)

Thanks & Clear Skies,
Gert


Do-it-yourself battery replacement in 'new' keypad vs have AP do it ? (Cost ?)

drgert1
 

Hello All,

I need to replace the keypad battery for my AP900 mount.The keypad is the 'newer' model (with resp. to being from AP900 a few years back when it was still offered) I've seen the symptoms as corrupted messier objects DB (magnitude 100). I have serviced two AP1200 mounts for our club and club members. Both where the 'older' model with the cr1632 (3V) battery.

I wasn't aware that there are two variants of the keypad, grabbed my printed instructions from the work at the AP1200s and went right to work. Got confused about the inside of the keypad. Soon realized that I erroneously removed the clock battery. Replaced it. Tried the keypad and time/date was still good. Does the clock chip has some emergency run-time? Could I have damaged something else? Functionality of keypad looks normal (Other than not (yet) having replaced the DB battery? )

The DB battery reads 0.4V. Way out of spec (3V)! So needs replacement.

Going back to AP docs, the procedure to replace the new keypad battery seems 'more tricky'.

1. Have some of you folks gone through the replacement procedure (new keypad) yourself? (Any issues?)
2. I am contemplating sending the keypad to AP and have them do it. Maybe they can do the clock battery and clean connectors at the same time.  (Did some if you do the same? What additional cost?)

Thanks & Clear Skies,
Gert


Re: What is the diameter and thread on the Pasil.4 polar scope?

Tom Blahovici
 

Sounds like I my have to rethink this...I certainly didn't think about having to try it and reposition it in the lathe.
I guess I will need some practice.
Thanks


Re: Mach1 problem please assist

Roland Christen
 

Turn PE OFF, run 15 minutes UNGUIDED with PHD2 showing the guider graph of star position.
Any guided graph is basically useless for mount troubleshooting.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Fri, Jun 19, 2020 2:33 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I'll check PE. But after cleaning I did a  "record" and it finished so I suspect it recorded a clean PE. 

I REALLY hate sending in the whole thing.  But would be nice to get it all tweaked. (PHD reports a good amount of backlash (not sure if its true)  It always has since new. The backlash graph is always off a good amount. I just ignore it. 


On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 2:19 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:

By the way, is it possible that you have PE correction turned on and you are playing back some bad data? We had this happen once on a mount at the Mauna Kea visitor center. Someone had manually entered a huge correction curve into the PE memory and was playing it back. Caused the mount to jump every worm cycle.

If this is not the case, then the mount needs to be sent in for evaluation. I can look at it the moment it arrives. Also send the cables and CP controller too, in case something is weird there.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Fri, Jun 19, 2020 10:02 am
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

Next night - I'll do a 2-3-4 worm cycle unguided.  I also may have one in a older log. I'll work on that. 
LAST NIGHTS. 

image.png

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 9:22 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
One other thing that would be extremely helpful is if you ran the mount for about 2 worm cycles (about 15 minutes) with guiding effectively off so i can see what the worm is actually doing. Posting a guided graph hides a lot of stuff that makes it hard to do actual trouble shooting.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 5:57 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I'll post then then try groups interface.
I logged out my best guess on each incursion.  There are no seconds so I had to estimate.
This would be the later set of errors that kicked UPWARD

about  12:38.55 sec
about  12:45.20 sec
about  12:51.50 sec
about  12:58.10
about  01:04.40
about  01:11.05
about  01:17.25
about  01:23.50 sec
about  01:30.15 sec

looks like they're spaced 6 min  20 seconds about.   That's about a worm repeat? 

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 6:50 PM Liam Plybon <liam@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
I believe you may have better luck by using an image hosting server and posting a link.
 
Groups is set to compress images automatically after complaints by users with slow or expensive internet who would have to download large images each time one was sent on the group. Especially here, where we all love sharing massive astro-images that can gobble up bandwidth.
 
Liam
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2020 17:40
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
Yep - one continuous run. Not near the meridian.  I'm attaching pics in email. It asks original, best fit etc.  Upon appearing it's a small little blurry version.
would it make them more clear if I enter the post in the groups interface and not in email?   These are BIG ANC CLEAR AND SHARP when I attach them.

I
shape.JPG
dental in shape when zooming in.
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 5:11 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
The graph shows 7 RA motions in the down direction, then a number of RA moves in the opposite direction. Is this over a period of time continuously? In other words, was this graph taken without interruption?
 
Roland
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
Capture is CLEAR and sharp. not sure what "GROUPS" does to images. I hate GROUPS.  Forums are better and allow you to retain/library of topics and Q&A, = (
I'll attach it again.  Is there a limit? size? restriction?    I'll attach at ORIGINAL SIZE

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 4:37 PM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I don't own use a keypad.   I did try that SWAP OVER - but I then cleaned it and not sure where it ended up.  Since the last test clearly had the saime  KICKS. I can do ig again.  
What does that do?  I think it might track toward the other side of the groove?  I'll swap it over again and see if it helps since re-greasing.

NICELY - greasing lowered my RA RMA error almost 50%.  Here is my history.

Mount arrived. I guided around 1.0.  Always trying to tweak it - not sure why but months later I was guiding at  .24 RMS error (arc set). yeah - that's awesome.
MANY months of that... The RASA guided better than my long APO.  But late winter I swapped RASA V1 for a RASA V2 (heavier) and ever since my guiding was 1.5 average.  My image scale is 1.69 
lately - the RA kicks put me into  1.7-2.0.  I get double stars on every other sub. 
I re-greased the RA and last night afterwards I was 1.1max and usuall around .89 tot rms arc sec. (nice)  But the RA still kicks and makes for double stars.  My dec was still poor so I'll regrease dec next and check
my alignment. (it's fairly perminent in a dome, but I have a tripod leg/mount and it "can move".  I usually check alignment 1-2 times a year or when ever guiding quality decreases. 
I am not aware of any gear scraping - I always release it clean...  I have on 3-4 occasions allowed it to track into a leg and (stop). Not sure if that hurts anything. But seems to work fine next time.

I don't understand why the RA kick changed from lower to higher (E to W?) the mount orientation did not change. 
I'll swap the part positions over and try again tonight.  During regreasing/cleaning I saw nothing strange. No chunks or crud.  old Grease moved quickly,  freely. not at all gummy. 
I have some pics n video.
 
 
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ron,
 
Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.
 
Can you do a test for me?
 
With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"
 
Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.
 
By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.

 
 
 
On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--


--


--


--


Re: Mach1 problem please assist

Ron Kramer
 

I'll check PE. But after cleaning I did a  "record" and it finished so I suspect it recorded a clean PE. 

I REALLY hate sending in the whole thing.  But would be nice to get it all tweaked. (PHD reports a good amount of backlash (not sure if its true)  It always has since new. The backlash graph is always off a good amount. I just ignore it. 


On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 2:19 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:

By the way, is it possible that you have PE correction turned on and you are playing back some bad data? We had this happen once on a mount at the Mauna Kea visitor center. Someone had manually entered a huge correction curve into the PE memory and was playing it back. Caused the mount to jump every worm cycle.

If this is not the case, then the mount needs to be sent in for evaluation. I can look at it the moment it arrives. Also send the cables and CP controller too, in case something is weird there.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Fri, Jun 19, 2020 10:02 am
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

Next night - I'll do a 2-3-4 worm cycle unguided.  I also may have one in a older log. I'll work on that. 
LAST NIGHTS. 

image.png

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 9:22 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
One other thing that would be extremely helpful is if you ran the mount for about 2 worm cycles (about 15 minutes) with guiding effectively off so i can see what the worm is actually doing. Posting a guided graph hides a lot of stuff that makes it hard to do actual trouble shooting.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 5:57 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I'll post then then try groups interface.
I logged out my best guess on each incursion.  There are no seconds so I had to estimate.
This would be the later set of errors that kicked UPWARD

about  12:38.55 sec
about  12:45.20 sec
about  12:51.50 sec
about  12:58.10
about  01:04.40
about  01:11.05
about  01:17.25
about  01:23.50 sec
about  01:30.15 sec

looks like they're spaced 6 min  20 seconds about.   That's about a worm repeat? 

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 6:50 PM Liam Plybon <liam@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
I believe you may have better luck by using an image hosting server and posting a link.
 
Groups is set to compress images automatically after complaints by users with slow or expensive internet who would have to download large images each time one was sent on the group. Especially here, where we all love sharing massive astro-images that can gobble up bandwidth.
 
Liam
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2020 17:40
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
Yep - one continuous run. Not near the meridian.  I'm attaching pics in email. It asks original, best fit etc.  Upon appearing it's a small little blurry version.
would it make them more clear if I enter the post in the groups interface and not in email?   These are BIG ANC CLEAR AND SHARP when I attach them.

I
shape.JPG
dental in shape when zooming in.
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 5:11 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
The graph shows 7 RA motions in the down direction, then a number of RA moves in the opposite direction. Is this over a period of time continuously? In other words, was this graph taken without interruption?
 
Roland
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
Capture is CLEAR and sharp. not sure what "GROUPS" does to images. I hate GROUPS.  Forums are better and allow you to retain/library of topics and Q&A, = (
I'll attach it again.  Is there a limit? size? restriction?    I'll attach at ORIGINAL SIZE

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 4:37 PM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I don't own use a keypad.   I did try that SWAP OVER - but I then cleaned it and not sure where it ended up.  Since the last test clearly had the saime  KICKS. I can do ig again.  
What does that do?  I think it might track toward the other side of the groove?  I'll swap it over again and see if it helps since re-greasing.

NICELY - greasing lowered my RA RMA error almost 50%.  Here is my history.

Mount arrived. I guided around 1.0.  Always trying to tweak it - not sure why but months later I was guiding at  .24 RMS error (arc set). yeah - that's awesome.
MANY months of that... The RASA guided better than my long APO.  But late winter I swapped RASA V1 for a RASA V2 (heavier) and ever since my guiding was 1.5 average.  My image scale is 1.69 
lately - the RA kicks put me into  1.7-2.0.  I get double stars on every other sub. 
I re-greased the RA and last night afterwards I was 1.1max and usuall around .89 tot rms arc sec. (nice)  But the RA still kicks and makes for double stars.  My dec was still poor so I'll regrease dec next and check
my alignment. (it's fairly perminent in a dome, but I have a tripod leg/mount and it "can move".  I usually check alignment 1-2 times a year or when ever guiding quality decreases. 
I am not aware of any gear scraping - I always release it clean...  I have on 3-4 occasions allowed it to track into a leg and (stop). Not sure if that hurts anything. But seems to work fine next time.

I don't understand why the RA kick changed from lower to higher (E to W?) the mount orientation did not change. 
I'll swap the part positions over and try again tonight.  During regreasing/cleaning I saw nothing strange. No chunks or crud.  old Grease moved quickly,  freely. not at all gummy. 
I have some pics n video.
 
 
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ron,
 
Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.
 
Can you do a test for me?
 
With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"
 
Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.
 
By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.

 
 
 
On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--


--


--




Re: Mach1 problem please assist

Roland Christen
 


I tried the park1 - (move manually to park 5) unpack from 5 and  (no change)  what is that supposed to do?  In my head, I can't think of any benefit/change.  The worm still continues doing what it does. ?
What is it supposed to do? Well for one thing it would tell me if the problem is on the worm wheel since doing this will expose a fresh set of teeth, and it is highly unlikely that each of the 225 teeth are exactly equally damaged to produce an exact same spike in RA tracking.

By the way, your problem might be bad data in the PEM memory. Turn PE correction off and run the mount with no guide input, just monitor the PE cycle via PHD2. No guiding corrections, turn them off. Your guided graphs are not useful for troubleshooting purposes.

Rolando


-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Fri, Jun 19, 2020 10:41 am
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I tried the park1 - (move manually to park 5) unpack from 5 and  (no change)  what is that supposed to do?  In my head, I can't think of any benefit/change.  The worm still continues doing what it does. ?

If this clearly is something in the gear box that isn't easily remedied by myself, I'd like to ship the box to AP for service.  I'd rather not sent the whole mount, the RA gearbox is a pretty easy ship item.




On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 11:03 AM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Next night - I'll do a 2-3-4 worm cycle unguided.  I also may have one in a older log. I'll work on that. 
LAST NIGHTS. 

image.png

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 9:22 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
One other thing that would be extremely helpful is if you ran the mount for about 2 worm cycles (about 15 minutes) with guiding effectively off so i can see what the worm is actually doing. Posting a guided graph hides a lot of stuff that makes it hard to do actual trouble shooting.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 5:57 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I'll post then then try groups interface.
I logged out my best guess on each incursion.  There are no seconds so I had to estimate.
This would be the later set of errors that kicked UPWARD

about  12:38.55 sec
about  12:45.20 sec
about  12:51.50 sec
about  12:58.10
about  01:04.40
about  01:11.05
about  01:17.25
about  01:23.50 sec
about  01:30.15 sec

looks like they're spaced 6 min  20 seconds about.   That's about a worm repeat? 

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 6:50 PM Liam Plybon <liam@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
I believe you may have better luck by using an image hosting server and posting a link.
 
Groups is set to compress images automatically after complaints by users with slow or expensive internet who would have to download large images each time one was sent on the group. Especially here, where we all love sharing massive astro-images that can gobble up bandwidth.
 
Liam
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2020 17:40
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
Yep - one continuous run. Not near the meridian.  I'm attaching pics in email. It asks original, best fit etc.  Upon appearing it's a small little blurry version.
would it make them more clear if I enter the post in the groups interface and not in email?   These are BIG ANC CLEAR AND SHARP when I attach them.

I
shape.JPG
dental in shape when zooming in.
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 5:11 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
The graph shows 7 RA motions in the down direction, then a number of RA moves in the opposite direction. Is this over a period of time continuously? In other words, was this graph taken without interruption?
 
Roland
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
Capture is CLEAR and sharp. not sure what "GROUPS" does to images. I hate GROUPS.  Forums are better and allow you to retain/library of topics and Q&A, = (
I'll attach it again.  Is there a limit? size? restriction?    I'll attach at ORIGINAL SIZE

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 4:37 PM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I don't own use a keypad.   I did try that SWAP OVER - but I then cleaned it and not sure where it ended up.  Since the last test clearly had the saime  KICKS. I can do ig again.  
What does that do?  I think it might track toward the other side of the groove?  I'll swap it over again and see if it helps since re-greasing.

NICELY - greasing lowered my RA RMA error almost 50%.  Here is my history.

Mount arrived. I guided around 1.0.  Always trying to tweak it - not sure why but months later I was guiding at  .24 RMS error (arc set). yeah - that's awesome.
MANY months of that... The RASA guided better than my long APO.  But late winter I swapped RASA V1 for a RASA V2 (heavier) and ever since my guiding was 1.5 average.  My image scale is 1.69 
lately - the RA kicks put me into  1.7-2.0.  I get double stars on every other sub. 
I re-greased the RA and last night afterwards I was 1.1max and usuall around .89 tot rms arc sec. (nice)  But the RA still kicks and makes for double stars.  My dec was still poor so I'll regrease dec next and check
my alignment. (it's fairly perminent in a dome, but I have a tripod leg/mount and it "can move".  I usually check alignment 1-2 times a year or when ever guiding quality decreases. 
I am not aware of any gear scraping - I always release it clean...  I have on 3-4 occasions allowed it to track into a leg and (stop). Not sure if that hurts anything. But seems to work fine next time.

I don't understand why the RA kick changed from lower to higher (E to W?) the mount orientation did not change. 
I'll swap the part positions over and try again tonight.  During regreasing/cleaning I saw nothing strange. No chunks or crud.  old Grease moved quickly,  freely. not at all gummy. 
I have some pics n video.
 
 
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ron,
 
Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.
 
Can you do a test for me?
 
With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"
 
Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.
 
By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.

 
 
 
On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--


--


--


--


Re: Mach1 problem please assist

Roland Christen
 


By the way, is it possible that you have PE correction turned on and you are playing back some bad data? We had this happen once on a mount at the Mauna Kea visitor center. Someone had manually entered a huge correction curve into the PE memory and was playing it back. Caused the mount to jump every worm cycle.

If this is not the case, then the mount needs to be sent in for evaluation. I can look at it the moment it arrives. Also send the cables and CP controller too, in case something is weird there.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Fri, Jun 19, 2020 10:02 am
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

Next night - I'll do a 2-3-4 worm cycle unguided.  I also may have one in a older log. I'll work on that. 
LAST NIGHTS. 

image.png

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 9:22 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
One other thing that would be extremely helpful is if you ran the mount for about 2 worm cycles (about 15 minutes) with guiding effectively off so i can see what the worm is actually doing. Posting a guided graph hides a lot of stuff that makes it hard to do actual trouble shooting.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 5:57 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I'll post then then try groups interface.
I logged out my best guess on each incursion.  There are no seconds so I had to estimate.
This would be the later set of errors that kicked UPWARD

about  12:38.55 sec
about  12:45.20 sec
about  12:51.50 sec
about  12:58.10
about  01:04.40
about  01:11.05
about  01:17.25
about  01:23.50 sec
about  01:30.15 sec

looks like they're spaced 6 min  20 seconds about.   That's about a worm repeat? 

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 6:50 PM Liam Plybon <liam@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
I believe you may have better luck by using an image hosting server and posting a link.
 
Groups is set to compress images automatically after complaints by users with slow or expensive internet who would have to download large images each time one was sent on the group. Especially here, where we all love sharing massive astro-images that can gobble up bandwidth.
 
Liam
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2020 17:40
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
Yep - one continuous run. Not near the meridian.  I'm attaching pics in email. It asks original, best fit etc.  Upon appearing it's a small little blurry version.
would it make them more clear if I enter the post in the groups interface and not in email?   These are BIG ANC CLEAR AND SHARP when I attach them.

I
shape.JPG
dental in shape when zooming in.
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 5:11 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
The graph shows 7 RA motions in the down direction, then a number of RA moves in the opposite direction. Is this over a period of time continuously? In other words, was this graph taken without interruption?
 
Roland
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
Capture is CLEAR and sharp. not sure what "GROUPS" does to images. I hate GROUPS.  Forums are better and allow you to retain/library of topics and Q&A, = (
I'll attach it again.  Is there a limit? size? restriction?    I'll attach at ORIGINAL SIZE

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 4:37 PM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I don't own use a keypad.   I did try that SWAP OVER - but I then cleaned it and not sure where it ended up.  Since the last test clearly had the saime  KICKS. I can do ig again.  
What does that do?  I think it might track toward the other side of the groove?  I'll swap it over again and see if it helps since re-greasing.

NICELY - greasing lowered my RA RMA error almost 50%.  Here is my history.

Mount arrived. I guided around 1.0.  Always trying to tweak it - not sure why but months later I was guiding at  .24 RMS error (arc set). yeah - that's awesome.
MANY months of that... The RASA guided better than my long APO.  But late winter I swapped RASA V1 for a RASA V2 (heavier) and ever since my guiding was 1.5 average.  My image scale is 1.69 
lately - the RA kicks put me into  1.7-2.0.  I get double stars on every other sub. 
I re-greased the RA and last night afterwards I was 1.1max and usuall around .89 tot rms arc sec. (nice)  But the RA still kicks and makes for double stars.  My dec was still poor so I'll regrease dec next and check
my alignment. (it's fairly perminent in a dome, but I have a tripod leg/mount and it "can move".  I usually check alignment 1-2 times a year or when ever guiding quality decreases. 
I am not aware of any gear scraping - I always release it clean...  I have on 3-4 occasions allowed it to track into a leg and (stop). Not sure if that hurts anything. But seems to work fine next time.

I don't understand why the RA kick changed from lower to higher (E to W?) the mount orientation did not change. 
I'll swap the part positions over and try again tonight.  During regreasing/cleaning I saw nothing strange. No chunks or crud.  old Grease moved quickly,  freely. not at all gummy. 
I have some pics n video.
 
 
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ron,
 
Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.
 
Can you do a test for me?
 
With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"
 
Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.
 
By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.

 
 
 
On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--


--


--


Re: Mach1 problem please assist

Ron Kramer
 

sorry for spamming... but I'm trying to track this down.  Looking at the good and bad logs (header) for settings.
I made a change.  Working log shows I was connected to the mount  "astro physics"  and the kicking log shows I made a change and connected to the AP mount through the ASCOM device hub. 
I also swapped out a ASI290 guide camera for the Lodestar SX.  
Curious.

On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 12:07 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Looking at older logs. The problem seems to have started recently. (there should be no reason for it on my part "HARDWARE" speaking.  
Is there an option in PHD that might cause this?  I had been playing with settings and even swapped my ASI290 for the Lodestar due to (over all poor guiding RMS error). 
While trying to improve this, this RA KICK arose. 

Here is a log from 5-1-2020
The RA kick doesn't seem to be happening. 

noraprob.JPG


On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 11:41 AM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I tried the park1 - (move manually to park 5) unpack from 5 and  (no change)  what is that supposed to do?  In my head, I can't think of any benefit/change.  The worm still continues doing what it does. ?

If this clearly is something in the gear box that isn't easily remedied by myself, I'd like to ship the box to AP for service.  I'd rather not sent the whole mount, the RA gearbox is a pretty easy ship item.




On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 11:03 AM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Next night - I'll do a 2-3-4 worm cycle unguided.  I also may have one in a older log. I'll work on that. 
LAST NIGHTS. 

image.png

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 9:22 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
One other thing that would be extremely helpful is if you ran the mount for about 2 worm cycles (about 15 minutes) with guiding effectively off so i can see what the worm is actually doing. Posting a guided graph hides a lot of stuff that makes it hard to do actual trouble shooting.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 5:57 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I'll post then then try groups interface.
I logged out my best guess on each incursion.  There are no seconds so I had to estimate.
This would be the later set of errors that kicked UPWARD

about  12:38.55 sec
about  12:45.20 sec
about  12:51.50 sec
about  12:58.10
about  01:04.40
about  01:11.05
about  01:17.25
about  01:23.50 sec
about  01:30.15 sec

looks like they're spaced 6 min  20 seconds about.   That's about a worm repeat? 

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 6:50 PM Liam Plybon <liam@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
I believe you may have better luck by using an image hosting server and posting a link.
 
Groups is set to compress images automatically after complaints by users with slow or expensive internet who would have to download large images each time one was sent on the group. Especially here, where we all love sharing massive astro-images that can gobble up bandwidth.
 
Liam
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2020 17:40
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
Yep - one continuous run. Not near the meridian.  I'm attaching pics in email. It asks original, best fit etc.  Upon appearing it's a small little blurry version.
would it make them more clear if I enter the post in the groups interface and not in email?   These are BIG ANC CLEAR AND SHARP when I attach them.

I
shape.JPG
dental in shape when zooming in.
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 5:11 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
The graph shows 7 RA motions in the down direction, then a number of RA moves in the opposite direction. Is this over a period of time continuously? In other words, was this graph taken without interruption?
 
Roland
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
Capture is CLEAR and sharp. not sure what "GROUPS" does to images. I hate GROUPS.  Forums are better and allow you to retain/library of topics and Q&A, = (
I'll attach it again.  Is there a limit? size? restriction?    I'll attach at ORIGINAL SIZE

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 4:37 PM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I don't own use a keypad.   I did try that SWAP OVER - but I then cleaned it and not sure where it ended up.  Since the last test clearly had the saime  KICKS. I can do ig again.  
What does that do?  I think it might track toward the other side of the groove?  I'll swap it over again and see if it helps since re-greasing.

NICELY - greasing lowered my RA RMA error almost 50%.  Here is my history.

Mount arrived. I guided around 1.0.  Always trying to tweak it - not sure why but months later I was guiding at  .24 RMS error (arc set). yeah - that's awesome.
MANY months of that... The RASA guided better than my long APO.  But late winter I swapped RASA V1 for a RASA V2 (heavier) and ever since my guiding was 1.5 average.  My image scale is 1.69 
lately - the RA kicks put me into  1.7-2.0.  I get double stars on every other sub. 
I re-greased the RA and last night afterwards I was 1.1max and usuall around .89 tot rms arc sec. (nice)  But the RA still kicks and makes for double stars.  My dec was still poor so I'll regrease dec next and check
my alignment. (it's fairly perminent in a dome, but I have a tripod leg/mount and it "can move".  I usually check alignment 1-2 times a year or when ever guiding quality decreases. 
I am not aware of any gear scraping - I always release it clean...  I have on 3-4 occasions allowed it to track into a leg and (stop). Not sure if that hurts anything. But seems to work fine next time.

I don't understand why the RA kick changed from lower to higher (E to W?) the mount orientation did not change. 
I'll swap the part positions over and try again tonight.  During regreasing/cleaning I saw nothing strange. No chunks or crud.  old Grease moved quickly,  freely. not at all gummy. 
I have some pics n video.
 
 
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ron,
 
Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.
 
Can you do a test for me?
 
With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"
 
Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.
 
By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.

 
 
 
On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--


--



--



--


--




Re: Mach1 problem please assist

Ron Kramer
 

Looking at older logs. The problem seems to have started recently. (there should be no reason for it on my part "HARDWARE" speaking.  
Is there an option in PHD that might cause this?  I had been playing with settings and even swapped my ASI290 for the Lodestar due to (over all poor guiding RMS error). 
While trying to improve this, this RA KICK arose. 

Here is a log from 5-1-2020
The RA kick doesn't seem to be happening. 

noraprob.JPG


On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 11:41 AM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I tried the park1 - (move manually to park 5) unpack from 5 and  (no change)  what is that supposed to do?  In my head, I can't think of any benefit/change.  The worm still continues doing what it does. ?

If this clearly is something in the gear box that isn't easily remedied by myself, I'd like to ship the box to AP for service.  I'd rather not sent the whole mount, the RA gearbox is a pretty easy ship item.




On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 11:03 AM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Next night - I'll do a 2-3-4 worm cycle unguided.  I also may have one in a older log. I'll work on that. 
LAST NIGHTS. 

image.png

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 9:22 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
One other thing that would be extremely helpful is if you ran the mount for about 2 worm cycles (about 15 minutes) with guiding effectively off so i can see what the worm is actually doing. Posting a guided graph hides a lot of stuff that makes it hard to do actual trouble shooting.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 5:57 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I'll post then then try groups interface.
I logged out my best guess on each incursion.  There are no seconds so I had to estimate.
This would be the later set of errors that kicked UPWARD

about  12:38.55 sec
about  12:45.20 sec
about  12:51.50 sec
about  12:58.10
about  01:04.40
about  01:11.05
about  01:17.25
about  01:23.50 sec
about  01:30.15 sec

looks like they're spaced 6 min  20 seconds about.   That's about a worm repeat? 

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 6:50 PM Liam Plybon <liam@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
I believe you may have better luck by using an image hosting server and posting a link.
 
Groups is set to compress images automatically after complaints by users with slow or expensive internet who would have to download large images each time one was sent on the group. Especially here, where we all love sharing massive astro-images that can gobble up bandwidth.
 
Liam
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2020 17:40
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
Yep - one continuous run. Not near the meridian.  I'm attaching pics in email. It asks original, best fit etc.  Upon appearing it's a small little blurry version.
would it make them more clear if I enter the post in the groups interface and not in email?   These are BIG ANC CLEAR AND SHARP when I attach them.

I
shape.JPG
dental in shape when zooming in.
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 5:11 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
The graph shows 7 RA motions in the down direction, then a number of RA moves in the opposite direction. Is this over a period of time continuously? In other words, was this graph taken without interruption?
 
Roland
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
Capture is CLEAR and sharp. not sure what "GROUPS" does to images. I hate GROUPS.  Forums are better and allow you to retain/library of topics and Q&A, = (
I'll attach it again.  Is there a limit? size? restriction?    I'll attach at ORIGINAL SIZE

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 4:37 PM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I don't own use a keypad.   I did try that SWAP OVER - but I then cleaned it and not sure where it ended up.  Since the last test clearly had the saime  KICKS. I can do ig again.  
What does that do?  I think it might track toward the other side of the groove?  I'll swap it over again and see if it helps since re-greasing.

NICELY - greasing lowered my RA RMA error almost 50%.  Here is my history.

Mount arrived. I guided around 1.0.  Always trying to tweak it - not sure why but months later I was guiding at  .24 RMS error (arc set). yeah - that's awesome.
MANY months of that... The RASA guided better than my long APO.  But late winter I swapped RASA V1 for a RASA V2 (heavier) and ever since my guiding was 1.5 average.  My image scale is 1.69 
lately - the RA kicks put me into  1.7-2.0.  I get double stars on every other sub. 
I re-greased the RA and last night afterwards I was 1.1max and usuall around .89 tot rms arc sec. (nice)  But the RA still kicks and makes for double stars.  My dec was still poor so I'll regrease dec next and check
my alignment. (it's fairly perminent in a dome, but I have a tripod leg/mount and it "can move".  I usually check alignment 1-2 times a year or when ever guiding quality decreases. 
I am not aware of any gear scraping - I always release it clean...  I have on 3-4 occasions allowed it to track into a leg and (stop). Not sure if that hurts anything. But seems to work fine next time.

I don't understand why the RA kick changed from lower to higher (E to W?) the mount orientation did not change. 
I'll swap the part positions over and try again tonight.  During regreasing/cleaning I saw nothing strange. No chunks or crud.  old Grease moved quickly,  freely. not at all gummy. 
I have some pics n video.
 
 
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ron,
 
Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.
 
Can you do a test for me?
 
With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"
 
Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.
 
By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.

 
 
 
On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--


--



--



--



Re: Mach1 problem please assist

Ron Kramer
 

I tried the park1 - (move manually to park 5) unpack from 5 and  (no change)  what is that supposed to do?  In my head, I can't think of any benefit/change.  The worm still continues doing what it does. ?

If this clearly is something in the gear box that isn't easily remedied by myself, I'd like to ship the box to AP for service.  I'd rather not sent the whole mount, the RA gearbox is a pretty easy ship item.




On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 11:03 AM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Next night - I'll do a 2-3-4 worm cycle unguided.  I also may have one in a older log. I'll work on that. 
LAST NIGHTS. 

image.png

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 9:22 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
One other thing that would be extremely helpful is if you ran the mount for about 2 worm cycles (about 15 minutes) with guiding effectively off so i can see what the worm is actually doing. Posting a guided graph hides a lot of stuff that makes it hard to do actual trouble shooting.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 5:57 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I'll post then then try groups interface.
I logged out my best guess on each incursion.  There are no seconds so I had to estimate.
This would be the later set of errors that kicked UPWARD

about  12:38.55 sec
about  12:45.20 sec
about  12:51.50 sec
about  12:58.10
about  01:04.40
about  01:11.05
about  01:17.25
about  01:23.50 sec
about  01:30.15 sec

looks like they're spaced 6 min  20 seconds about.   That's about a worm repeat? 

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 6:50 PM Liam Plybon <liam@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
I believe you may have better luck by using an image hosting server and posting a link.
 
Groups is set to compress images automatically after complaints by users with slow or expensive internet who would have to download large images each time one was sent on the group. Especially here, where we all love sharing massive astro-images that can gobble up bandwidth.
 
Liam
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2020 17:40
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
Yep - one continuous run. Not near the meridian.  I'm attaching pics in email. It asks original, best fit etc.  Upon appearing it's a small little blurry version.
would it make them more clear if I enter the post in the groups interface and not in email?   These are BIG ANC CLEAR AND SHARP when I attach them.

I
shape.JPG
dental in shape when zooming in.
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 5:11 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
The graph shows 7 RA motions in the down direction, then a number of RA moves in the opposite direction. Is this over a period of time continuously? In other words, was this graph taken without interruption?
 
Roland
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
Capture is CLEAR and sharp. not sure what "GROUPS" does to images. I hate GROUPS.  Forums are better and allow you to retain/library of topics and Q&A, = (
I'll attach it again.  Is there a limit? size? restriction?    I'll attach at ORIGINAL SIZE

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 4:37 PM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I don't own use a keypad.   I did try that SWAP OVER - but I then cleaned it and not sure where it ended up.  Since the last test clearly had the saime  KICKS. I can do ig again.  
What does that do?  I think it might track toward the other side of the groove?  I'll swap it over again and see if it helps since re-greasing.

NICELY - greasing lowered my RA RMA error almost 50%.  Here is my history.

Mount arrived. I guided around 1.0.  Always trying to tweak it - not sure why but months later I was guiding at  .24 RMS error (arc set). yeah - that's awesome.
MANY months of that... The RASA guided better than my long APO.  But late winter I swapped RASA V1 for a RASA V2 (heavier) and ever since my guiding was 1.5 average.  My image scale is 1.69 
lately - the RA kicks put me into  1.7-2.0.  I get double stars on every other sub. 
I re-greased the RA and last night afterwards I was 1.1max and usuall around .89 tot rms arc sec. (nice)  But the RA still kicks and makes for double stars.  My dec was still poor so I'll regrease dec next and check
my alignment. (it's fairly perminent in a dome, but I have a tripod leg/mount and it "can move".  I usually check alignment 1-2 times a year or when ever guiding quality decreases. 
I am not aware of any gear scraping - I always release it clean...  I have on 3-4 occasions allowed it to track into a leg and (stop). Not sure if that hurts anything. But seems to work fine next time.

I don't understand why the RA kick changed from lower to higher (E to W?) the mount orientation did not change. 
I'll swap the part positions over and try again tonight.  During regreasing/cleaning I saw nothing strange. No chunks or crud.  old Grease moved quickly,  freely. not at all gummy. 
I have some pics n video.
 
 
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ron,
 
Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.
 
Can you do a test for me?
 
With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"
 
Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.
 
By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.

 
 
 
On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--


--



--




Re: Mach1 problem please assist

Ron Kramer
 

Next night - I'll do a 2-3-4 worm cycle unguided.  I also may have one in a older log. I'll work on that. 
LAST NIGHTS. 

image.png

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 9:22 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
One other thing that would be extremely helpful is if you ran the mount for about 2 worm cycles (about 15 minutes) with guiding effectively off so i can see what the worm is actually doing. Posting a guided graph hides a lot of stuff that makes it hard to do actual trouble shooting.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 5:57 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I'll post then then try groups interface.
I logged out my best guess on each incursion.  There are no seconds so I had to estimate.
This would be the later set of errors that kicked UPWARD

about  12:38.55 sec
about  12:45.20 sec
about  12:51.50 sec
about  12:58.10
about  01:04.40
about  01:11.05
about  01:17.25
about  01:23.50 sec
about  01:30.15 sec

looks like they're spaced 6 min  20 seconds about.   That's about a worm repeat? 

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 6:50 PM Liam Plybon <liam@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
I believe you may have better luck by using an image hosting server and posting a link.
 
Groups is set to compress images automatically after complaints by users with slow or expensive internet who would have to download large images each time one was sent on the group. Especially here, where we all love sharing massive astro-images that can gobble up bandwidth.
 
Liam
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2020 17:40
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
Yep - one continuous run. Not near the meridian.  I'm attaching pics in email. It asks original, best fit etc.  Upon appearing it's a small little blurry version.
would it make them more clear if I enter the post in the groups interface and not in email?   These are BIG ANC CLEAR AND SHARP when I attach them.

I
shape.JPG
dental in shape when zooming in.
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 5:11 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
The graph shows 7 RA motions in the down direction, then a number of RA moves in the opposite direction. Is this over a period of time continuously? In other words, was this graph taken without interruption?
 
Roland
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
Capture is CLEAR and sharp. not sure what "GROUPS" does to images. I hate GROUPS.  Forums are better and allow you to retain/library of topics and Q&A, = (
I'll attach it again.  Is there a limit? size? restriction?    I'll attach at ORIGINAL SIZE

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 4:37 PM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I don't own use a keypad.   I did try that SWAP OVER - but I then cleaned it and not sure where it ended up.  Since the last test clearly had the saime  KICKS. I can do ig again.  
What does that do?  I think it might track toward the other side of the groove?  I'll swap it over again and see if it helps since re-greasing.

NICELY - greasing lowered my RA RMA error almost 50%.  Here is my history.

Mount arrived. I guided around 1.0.  Always trying to tweak it - not sure why but months later I was guiding at  .24 RMS error (arc set). yeah - that's awesome.
MANY months of that... The RASA guided better than my long APO.  But late winter I swapped RASA V1 for a RASA V2 (heavier) and ever since my guiding was 1.5 average.  My image scale is 1.69 
lately - the RA kicks put me into  1.7-2.0.  I get double stars on every other sub. 
I re-greased the RA and last night afterwards I was 1.1max and usuall around .89 tot rms arc sec. (nice)  But the RA still kicks and makes for double stars.  My dec was still poor so I'll regrease dec next and check
my alignment. (it's fairly perminent in a dome, but I have a tripod leg/mount and it "can move".  I usually check alignment 1-2 times a year or when ever guiding quality decreases. 
I am not aware of any gear scraping - I always release it clean...  I have on 3-4 occasions allowed it to track into a leg and (stop). Not sure if that hurts anything. But seems to work fine next time.

I don't understand why the RA kick changed from lower to higher (E to W?) the mount orientation did not change. 
I'll swap the part positions over and try again tonight.  During regreasing/cleaning I saw nothing strange. No chunks or crud.  old Grease moved quickly,  freely. not at all gummy. 
I have some pics n video.
 
 
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ron,
 
Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.
 
Can you do a test for me?
 
With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"
 
Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.
 
By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.

 
 
 
On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--

 
--


--




Re: What is the diameter and thread on the Pasil.4 polar scope?

Len Fulham
 

Joe & Tom,

 I understand the concern, but provided there is a positive length location (registering to surface of Chuck) AND the cutting gear train is kept engaged (so nothing can move independently( = picking up the cut) AND an alignment mark is used to control rotational position, then very accurate and repeatable threading operations can proceed. In most circumstances the alignment mark does not need high precision  - an error of 0.5mm in rotation on a 40mm dia 1mm pitch thread corresponds to a error at the cutting tool of about 0.004mm (0.0002inch).
With quality equipment, e.g. my precision Pratt Burned chuck, which probably cost more than the whole mini lathe, this is achievable. But even cheap chucks which may have noticeable runout are usually quite repeatable. Even if the error is 5 times worse it still corresponds to only 0.02mm (0.001 inch). Just needs a bit of care to be clean and attentive to detail.

Otherwise, what should a beginner do - at some point it has to come out of the lathe and be mated to the mount - if it does not fit or is too 'snug' - throw it away and start again? or put it back in and take another little cut?

Tom, ideally you should learn to measure and specify threads properly, micrometer and three wires etc, but I have had commercial CNC cut products (thinking Celestron) which do not fit. Maybe before your first real part, you should make a 1/2" thread to fit a 1/2" nut as an exercise; get to know your machine.

I have done what I described above and it works.

Good luck,

Len.

PS Its never luck, care and attention to detail wins.


Re: help with AP900 guiding via ASIAir Pro

sgbonnell@...
 

Success!   That worked Ray..
PHD2 was guiding perfectly...I was getting total rms values averaging .3" and down to .25" at times over 3 hours last night.
Seeing was very good, with a light breeze at times, but I did not fine tune the mount balance and just used the starting values in PHD2 - I was so happy to see it running with very nice performance that I left it alone for the evening.    
Other than battling legions of mosquitos, it was a great night :-)

thanks again for your help...let me know if/when you sort out the issue with the latest release.
Steve


Re: Tripod for MC254 and Mach1

Elenillor
 

Len,

I tried anti-vibration pads years ago when I lived in Japan and observed from a 15th story balcony.  I found the pads made touch induced vibration worse (such as focusing) but somewhat reduce vibration coming thru the building.


Re: What is the diameter and thread on the Pasil.4 polar scope?

Joe Zeglinski
 

Hi Len,
 
    Interesting short cut with testing the part, but I would be concerned about “repeatability”.
Tom would have to not only mount the part,  back into the lathe chuck in two directions, he would also have to position the lathe cutter blade precisely in the original thread groove, and resume the lathe travel worm.
 
    Somehow, I feel that there are too many variables,  with a greater chance of the final threads ending up, cut too thin and thus loose fitting, if all isn’t repositioned  precisely, after a  part test-fit. It may be OK for a smooth bar operation, but threading resumption might be  less forgiving, no matter how careful one is.
 
Joe Z.


Re: What is the diameter and thread on the Pasil.4 polar scope?

Len Fulham
 

Tom,
"I might as well get some use on my new mini lathe. I'm thinking of delrin or brass."

For your adapter use brass or aluminium, Threads in delrin are harder to do than expected unless everything is set perfectly.

Are you experienced with lathe use & threading? if so read no more. Otherwise there is a simple way to remove and return your piece (e.g. to test fit) without losing thread registration.  This assumes there is a flat face or ring which registers against the face of the chuck or (less good) chuck jaws. Having progressed your thread to the point you wish to test it, back off/withdraw the cutting tool but leave everything engaged; then use a felt pen and make a line on the side of the workpiece onto a chuck jaw or face of the chuck. Now you can take it out of the chuck, play with it, test, then return it to the chuck in the same position and make further cuts as required. Accuracy is improved by tightening the chuck using each key position sequentially, and the same when you rechuck it. Don't rub the pen mark off!

You should be able to place the piece back in the chuck to the same depth and square (flat surface register) and the felt pen mark will let you have the thread back in alignment with minimal change. Make some test passes with the cutting tool backed out and progressively feed in until cutting is resumed.

It is easier to do this than just hope your part will fit ( if your metrology is first class, then no worries).

Not a machining forum so we shouldn't expand this too much.

Cheers,

Len.


Re: Tripod for MC254 and Mach1

Len Fulham
 

Your problem may be more than this can solve, but there are anti vibration pads which could help:
 
 
I have them for my Eagle and the AP portable pier, although I got them primarily to stop settling in sand etc
 
Cheers,
Len.


Re: Mach1 problem please assist

Roland Christen
 

One other thing that would be extremely helpful is if you ran the mount for about 2 worm cycles (about 15 minutes) with guiding effectively off so i can see what the worm is actually doing. Posting a guided graph hides a lot of stuff that makes it hard to do actual trouble shooting.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 5:57 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist

I'll post then then try groups interface.
I logged out my best guess on each incursion.  There are no seconds so I had to estimate.
This would be the later set of errors that kicked UPWARD

about  12:38.55 sec
about  12:45.20 sec
about  12:51.50 sec
about  12:58.10
about  01:04.40
about  01:11.05
about  01:17.25
about  01:23.50 sec
about  01:30.15 sec

looks like they're spaced 6 min  20 seconds about.   That's about a worm repeat? 

On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 6:50 PM Liam Plybon <liam@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
I believe you may have better luck by using an image hosting server and posting a link.
 
Groups is set to compress images automatically after complaints by users with slow or expensive internet who would have to download large images each time one was sent on the group. Especially here, where we all love sharing massive astro-images that can gobble up bandwidth.
 
Liam
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2020 17:40
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
Yep - one continuous run. Not near the meridian.  I'm attaching pics in email. It asks original, best fit etc.  Upon appearing it's a small little blurry version.
would it make them more clear if I enter the post in the groups interface and not in email?   These are BIG ANC CLEAR AND SHARP when I attach them.

I
shape.JPG
dental in shape when zooming in.
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 5:11 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
The graph shows 7 RA motions in the down direction, then a number of RA moves in the opposite direction. Is this over a period of time continuously? In other words, was this graph taken without interruption?
 
Roland
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
Capture is CLEAR and sharp. not sure what "GROUPS" does to images. I hate GROUPS.  Forums are better and allow you to retain/library of topics and Q&A, = (
I'll attach it again.  Is there a limit? size? restriction?    I'll attach at ORIGINAL SIZE

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 4:37 PM Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...> wrote:
I don't own use a keypad.   I did try that SWAP OVER - but I then cleaned it and not sure where it ended up.  Since the last test clearly had the saime  KICKS. I can do ig again.  
What does that do?  I think it might track toward the other side of the groove?  I'll swap it over again and see if it helps since re-greasing.

NICELY - greasing lowered my RA RMA error almost 50%.  Here is my history.

Mount arrived. I guided around 1.0.  Always trying to tweak it - not sure why but months later I was guiding at  .24 RMS error (arc set). yeah - that's awesome.
MANY months of that... The RASA guided better than my long APO.  But late winter I swapped RASA V1 for a RASA V2 (heavier) and ever since my guiding was 1.5 average.  My image scale is 1.69 
lately - the RA kicks put me into  1.7-2.0.  I get double stars on every other sub. 
I re-greased the RA and last night afterwards I was 1.1max and usuall around .89 tot rms arc sec. (nice)  But the RA still kicks and makes for double stars.  My dec was still poor so I'll regrease dec next and check
my alignment. (it's fairly perminent in a dome, but I have a tripod leg/mount and it "can move".  I usually check alignment 1-2 times a year or when ever guiding quality decreases. 
I am not aware of any gear scraping - I always release it clean...  I have on 3-4 occasions allowed it to track into a leg and (stop). Not sure if that hurts anything. But seems to work fine next time.

I don't understand why the RA kick changed from lower to higher (E to W?) the mount orientation did not change. 
I'll swap the part positions over and try again tonight.  During regreasing/cleaning I saw nothing strange. No chunks or crud.  old Grease moved quickly,  freely. not at all gummy. 
I have some pics n video.
 
 
 
On Thu, Jun 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hello Ron,
 
Howard won't be able to answer you at this time.
 
Can you do a test for me?
 
With keypad in Autostart NO, send the mount to Park1 and turn off power.
Loosen the clutches and move the mount to Park5 manually.
Turn power back on and press "Resume from Park5"
 
Now check to see if the RA anomaly persists. let me know the results and we can go from there.
 
By the way, your screen shot is so blurry I cannot make out any details on it.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Jun 18, 2020 1:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
I re-greased the RA.  It was really relaxing and nothing to fear.  No springs jumped out at me or other crazy surprises. 
The first test last night showed my RA improved by almost 50% reduction in RA RMS error.  (I'm shocked).

On the bad side, I did not fix my RA KICK problem.  I did not see RA worm flaws except on the very end (3 turns) of the worm and I'm sure that is never in contact with the drive gear.
I have emailed Howard... but wondered if it helps determine the problem from last night's guide log.  I was surprised to see it FLIPPED the RA kick.  (no meridian flip took place) why would it flip? 

RA KICK.JPG
 
On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 4:21 PM Ron Kramer via groups.io <ronkramer1957=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Kit arrived late last night. (UPS error)
Today it was hot in the dome so I just did the RA worm and drive gear. And the side gears)
I hope to test tonight and see if it solves my RA kicking problem. 

I inspected the worm and was in fine shape - EXCEPT I had some very rough area which I don't think matters. It was way over on the very edges of the worm... like the last 2-3 turns were rough. I don't believe this are ever used? 

I greased the entire worm even though it said just the center is all that's needed. Figured it would help ward off corrosion.   The process wasn't scary once the RA box was removed. In fact (I don't recommend this) but I didn't even take my gear off the mount.  RASA 11 + essentials upside down at times.   I forgot about the cords but never turned more than 180.  I actually read the instructions after I was done. (common for me, I like to dig in) then see what I did wrong. 

SOUNDS nice... Will see if the RA hiccups tonight in a guiding test.  if all is good I'll do DEC tomorrow but RA was a primary concern as it would jump and killed every other sub.

Will see tonight.

 
 
 
On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 4:33 PM Marj Christen <marj@...> wrote:
Ron,
 
Now that our production staff has returned, the turnaround time for repairs is pretty quick. There is no standard cost for a “ tune up” since it depends on what is involved and if parts have to be replaced.
 
Try regreasing first and contact us again if you can’t resolve the issue.
 
Clear Skies,
 
Marj Christen
Astro-Physics, Inc
11250 Forest Hills Rd
Machesney Park, IL 61115
Phone: 815-282-1513
Fax: 815-282-9847
 
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Ron Kramer
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:33 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
 
I'm about to try to re-grease - I'll see if I can see something during inspection.  Is swapping the worm something easy I can do at home? 
I don't want to do anything complicated. I don't believe I've nicked a gear - I only use park3.  But it has come against the pier during a few 3-4 occasions? Would that do anything?

How much does it cost to send it in for a tune up?  HOW LONG would I be without it?  I'm near in Grand Rapids, MI.
I'll look for a clump of anything in the worm teeth.  If I send it in I don 't want it waiting for weeks/days. What is time frame? 
I ordered the grease, I'll see how that goes.
 
 
On Tue, Jun 9, 2020 at 7:51 PM uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> wrote:
Forget backlash in RA. There is no such thing. RA always tracks so it never reverses. Backlash does not enter into tracking.
 
You may have damaged your worm teeth when you backed off the worm to do a fine balance. You may have forgotten to do it only in the Park3 position. If that's the case, the worm may have a nick in the teeth and it will show up as a repeating pattern once every 6.4 minutes.
 
Rolando
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Kramer <ronkramer1957@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 9, 2020 3:30 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Mach1 problem please assist
My mach1 is about 2.5 years old.  I was getting awesome guiding with a total rms error of .24 arc sec.  
Winter came and went and this spring it's been horrible.  like  1.4.   My image scale is about 1.69 so I lived with that for a while, but lately
the RA is  KICKING in almost a timely fashion.  One of these kicks makes double stars.  Around 1/2 my subs have to be deleted.
Nothing I have tried to far has fixed it.
I will include the log from a couple nights ago to show what I mean. 
I did a new calibration - then a guide assistant for a while... then set recommendations and let it guide a while.
You'll see   RA  kicking like a mule in a rather evenly timed fashion!?!  
I would so appreciate help with this.  Someone in PHD said make sure the mount software/HC doesn't have backlash on.  
I DO NOT USE or own a HC and I don't know of any BackLash setting in APCC pro.  I'm going nuts. 
 
 

 
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