Date   

Re: Imaging during EST to DST change over

Roland Christen
 

The mount won't park itself unless it gets a park command from a 3rd party software. A clock change on your PC does not automatically get sent to the mount by itself, so the mount does not know about any time change.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Fakatselis <pashasdad@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Sent: Sun, Mar 14, 2021 11:25 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Imaging during EST to DST change over

Last night I was imaging with my QSI683 camera through the AP 130EDF on my Mach1GTO and had an unusual thing happen. I was on my last subframe of the evening, at around 2am and suddenly I noticed that the guiding errors grew tremendously.

I noticed the guide star was out of the field so I grabbed an additional full frame exposure through the guide camera to see what had happened. A 5 sec exposure showed stars streaking in the field of view, like the tracking was incorrect or even off.

After closer inspection I noticed that the mount parked itself at exactly 2:00am when the PC's clock automatically advanced from 2:00am to 3:00am during the EST to DST transition. It wasn't too much of a problem since I was closing down for the night anyway, so I lost the 10 min subframe.
I was wondering why/how the mount automatically parked due to that sudden time shift Any ideas? Anyone else had this happen to them?

Jim Fakatselis
Peppermill Skies Observatory
Huntington, NY

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Re: Which GTOCP* connection do you use?

Kenneth Tan
 

Can i use the gtocp4 with my mach2 gto? I was toying with the idea as that will allow me to connect it with the ASI air pro which does not seem as yet to support the gtocp5. 

Kenneth 

On Mon, 15 Mar 2021 at 16:29, <cargostick@...> wrote:
I should have put keypad as a choice in the poll.


Re: Quick Release Gearbox Modification for Older AP1600

Jack Huerkamp
 

George,

 

That is what I thought.  But reading the PDF you provided a link to got me confused when I got to step 6 and the positioning of the DOVELM163 on the Dec Axis.

 

Yours truly,

 

Jack

 

Jack Huerkamp

Jack's Astro Accessories, LLC

38388 Pine Street

Pearl River, LA 70452-5192

985-445-5063

mallincamusa@...

www.mallincamusa.com

30.37N  89.76W

 

All of us get lost in the darkness.
Dreamers learn to steer by the stars.

………………………………….Neil Peart

 

 

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of George
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2021 10:07 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Quick Release Gearbox Modification for Older AP1600

 

Jack,

 

No.   First you balancing each scope front to back when they are set up exactly as they will be used (and focused),    Mark the balance point with blue painter’s tape.   Then put them into their saddles at those balance points.    Finally set the whole grouping on a dowel rod to find the balance point side to side and mark it with the tape.    It can then be set up on the mount and be very close.

 

Regards,

 

George

 

George Whitney

Astro-Physics, Inc.

Phone:  815-222-6538 (direct line)

Phone:  815-282-1513 (office)

Email:  george@...

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jack Huerkamp
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2021 9:39 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Cc: mallincamusa@...
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Quick Release Gearbox Modification for Older AP1600

 

George,

 

So you assemble everything on the side to side plate – both scopes and accessories – and then place the dowel rod under the assembly and check the balance point for position the side to side plate in the DOVELM162 bolted to the top of the Dec axis.  Mark the side to side plate to indicate the balance point.

 

You can then rotate the dowel rod 90 degrees under the center of the side to side plate to make sure the entire assembly is balanced in the north-south direction.  If so, leaving all the makes in place, disassemble the scopes from the side by side plate and reassemble onto the DOVELM162.

 

If this is correct, I will get help in removing all the scopes, take off the counterweights and counterweight shaft and then do a gear cleaning and lubrication before re-assembling everything.

 

Yours truly,

 

Jack

 

Jack Huerkamp

Jack's Astro Accessories, LLC

38388 Pine Street

Pearl River, LA 70452-5192

985-445-5063

mallincamusa@...

www.mallincamusa.com

30.37N  89.76W

 

All of us get lost in the darkness.
Dreamers learn to steer by the stars.

………………………………….Neil Peart

 

 

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of George
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2021 8:46 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Quick Release Gearbox Modification for Older AP1600

 

Jack,

 

No.   Dowel rod under the side-to-side plate.

 

Regards,

 

George

 

George Whitney

Astro-Physics, Inc.

Phone:  815-222-6538 (direct line)

Phone:  815-282-1513 (office)

Email:  george@...

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jack Huerkamp
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2021 7:40 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Quick Release Gearbox Modification for Older AP1600

 

George,

I read through the Balancing Side-by-Side procedures you provided a link to and understood everything until I got to Steps 6 through 9.  Photos would sure help me visualize what is going on.

Is the Primary Saddle Plate removed from the mount when doing these steps?

I have the DOVELM162 mounted onto the AP1600 and I think there was only one position I could place it in to allow me to use all the bolt holes tapped in the top of the mount.

Yours truly,

Jack Huerkamp

 

 

Image removed by sender.

Virus-free. www.avg.com


Re: Quick Release Gearbox Modification for Older AP1600

George
 

Jack,

 

No.   First you balancing each scope front to back when they are set up exactly as they will be used (and focused),    Mark the balance point with blue painter’s tape.   Then put them into their saddles at those balance points.    Finally set the whole grouping on a dowel rod to find the balance point side to side and mark it with the tape.    It can then be set up on the mount and be very close.

 

Regards,

 

George

 

George Whitney

Astro-Physics, Inc.

Phone:  815-222-6538 (direct line)

Phone:  815-282-1513 (office)

Email:  george@...

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jack Huerkamp
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2021 9:39 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Cc: mallincamusa@...
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Quick Release Gearbox Modification for Older AP1600

 

George,

 

So you assemble everything on the side to side plate – both scopes and accessories – and then place the dowel rod under the assembly and check the balance point for position the side to side plate in the DOVELM162 bolted to the top of the Dec axis.  Mark the side to side plate to indicate the balance point.

 

You can then rotate the dowel rod 90 degrees under the center of the side to side plate to make sure the entire assembly is balanced in the north-south direction.  If so, leaving all the makes in place, disassemble the scopes from the side by side plate and reassemble onto the DOVELM162.

 

If this is correct, I will get help in removing all the scopes, take off the counterweights and counterweight shaft and then do a gear cleaning and lubrication before re-assembling everything.

 

Yours truly,

 

Jack

 

Jack Huerkamp

Jack's Astro Accessories, LLC

38388 Pine Street

Pearl River, LA 70452-5192

985-445-5063

mallincamusa@...

www.mallincamusa.com

30.37N  89.76W

 

All of us get lost in the darkness.
Dreamers learn to steer by the stars.

………………………………….Neil Peart

 

 

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of George
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2021 8:46 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Quick Release Gearbox Modification for Older AP1600

 

Jack,

 

No.   Dowel rod under the side-to-side plate.

 

Regards,

 

George

 

George Whitney

Astro-Physics, Inc.

Phone:  815-222-6538 (direct line)

Phone:  815-282-1513 (office)

Email:  george@...

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jack Huerkamp
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2021 7:40 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Quick Release Gearbox Modification for Older AP1600

 

George,

I read through the Balancing Side-by-Side procedures you provided a link to and understood everything until I got to Steps 6 through 9.  Photos would sure help me visualize what is going on.

Is the Primary Saddle Plate removed from the mount when doing these steps?

I have the DOVELM162 mounted onto the AP1600 and I think there was only one position I could place it in to allow me to use all the bolt holes tapped in the top of the mount.

Yours truly,

Jack Huerkamp

 

 

Image removed by sender.

Virus-free. www.avg.com


Re: Quick Release Gearbox Modification for Older AP1600

Jack Huerkamp
 

George,

 

So you assemble everything on the side to side plate – both scopes and accessories – and then place the dowel rod under the assembly and check the balance point for position the side to side plate in the DOVELM162 bolted to the top of the Dec axis.  Mark the side to side plate to indicate the balance point.

 

You can then rotate the dowel rod 90 degrees under the center of the side to side plate to make sure the entire assembly is balanced in the north-south direction.  If so, leaving all the makes in place, disassemble the scopes from the side by side plate and reassemble onto the DOVELM162.

 

If this is correct, I will get help in removing all the scopes, take off the counterweights and counterweight shaft and then do a gear cleaning and lubrication before re-assembling everything.

 

Yours truly,

 

Jack

 

Jack Huerkamp

Jack's Astro Accessories, LLC

38388 Pine Street

Pearl River, LA 70452-5192

985-445-5063

mallincamusa@...

www.mallincamusa.com

30.37N  89.76W

 

All of us get lost in the darkness.
Dreamers learn to steer by the stars.

………………………………….Neil Peart

 

 

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of George
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2021 8:46 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Quick Release Gearbox Modification for Older AP1600

 

Jack,

 

No.   Dowel rod under the side-to-side plate.

 

Regards,

 

George

 

George Whitney

Astro-Physics, Inc.

Phone:  815-222-6538 (direct line)

Phone:  815-282-1513 (office)

Email:  george@...

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jack Huerkamp
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2021 7:40 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Quick Release Gearbox Modification for Older AP1600

 

George,

I read through the Balancing Side-by-Side procedures you provided a link to and understood everything until I got to Steps 6 through 9.  Photos would sure help me visualize what is going on.

Is the Primary Saddle Plate removed from the mount when doing these steps?

I have the DOVELM162 mounted onto the AP1600 and I think there was only one position I could place it in to allow me to use all the bolt holes tapped in the top of the mount.

Yours truly,

Jack Huerkamp

 


Virus-free. www.avg.com


Re: Quick Release Gearbox Modification for Older AP1600

George
 

Jack,

 

No.   Dowel rod under the side-to-side plate.

 

Regards,

 

George

 

George Whitney

Astro-Physics, Inc.

Phone:  815-222-6538 (direct line)

Phone:  815-282-1513 (office)

Email:  george@...

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jack Huerkamp
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2021 7:40 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Quick Release Gearbox Modification for Older AP1600

 

George,

I read through the Balancing Side-by-Side procedures you provided a link to and understood everything until I got to Steps 6 through 9.  Photos would sure help me visualize what is going on.

Is the Primary Saddle Plate removed from the mount when doing these steps?

I have the DOVELM162 mounted onto the AP1600 and I think there was only one position I could place it in to allow me to use all the bolt holes tapped in the top of the mount.

Yours truly,

Jack Huerkamp

 


Re: Which GTOCP* connection do you use?

Eric Dreher
 

I use Ethernet for my Mach1GTO, CP4.  Through the mount cabling includes POE for my Optec focuser, a single USB3 for the three ASCOM devices, and a 12VDC for the cooler.  These go to a homemade, personally designed distribution box, then to my laptop.  Never a failure of any kind.


Re: Quick Release Gearbox Modification for Older AP1600

Jack Huerkamp
 

George,

I read through the Balancing Side-by-Side procedures you provided a link to and understood everything until I got to Steps 6 through 9.  Photos would sure help me visualize what is going on.

Is the Primary Saddle Plate removed from the mount when doing these steps?

I have the DOVELM162 mounted onto the AP1600 and I think there was only one position I could place it in to allow me to use all the bolt holes tapped in the top of the mount.

Yours truly,

Jack Huerkamp

 


Re: Which GTOCP* connection do you use?

Roger Howard
 

I should have put keypad as a choice in the poll.


Daylight savings and APCC pro

steven ho
 

APCC pro and PHD2 are used to control all mount movements during my sessions. I was imaging Saturday March 13th into Sunday March 14th, in the eastern time zone. My session continued through 2AM and the time change. At the end of the night the AP-1600AE was parked at position 4. the attached image shows it did not properly park and the RA axis settled an hour East of where it should have. This has happened to me in the past and I would loosen the clutches use a level to reset the RA axis and then tell the mount is was in Park position 4. 
 
Do I have some configuration setting incorrect? Or is the normal behavior that's expected?
 
Also is there a trick for recovering without loosening the clutches?
 
Thank you!!
Steve Hoffman



Re: Which GTOCP* connection do you use?

Ben Lutch
 


Question for Roland - if you are imaging with both cameras simultaneously, how do you coordinate dithers?
thanks,
b

On Sun, Mar 14, 2021 at 8:09 PM Terry Martin <terry@...> wrote:
I use USB to the CP5. I have an Eagle 3 mounted on top of my scope.  Its 12 volt power comes from the through the mount power connection, which it then powers all the devices.  The USB from the CP5 feeds into the Eagle through the mount. I use a tiny portable router which just sits on the Eagle using Velcro. The Eagle connects to the router via ethernet cable and I remote into the router via Microsoft Remote Desktop (the Eagle WIFI is not very reliable). It all works really well. 

I run NINA via ASCOM and TheSkyX via ASCOM.

Terry


Re: Imaging during EST to DST change over

Dale Ghent
 

Internally, mounts operate on UTC time only and don't care about/know about silly constructs such as DST and time zones. I would pull the session's logs from whatever imaging or sequencing program you're using and APCC, if you're using that.

I've seen funny things with lots of programs over the years regarding their reaction to DST changes, the start of DST in particular. A typical scenario is a program monitors IO for timeouts based on local wall clock time, and not seconds elapsed. Suddenly time jumps forward 1 hour and the program is convinced that it hadn't heard anything for an hour, and reacts in an improper way.

On Mar 15, 2021, at 00:25, Jim Fakatselis <pashasdad@gmail.com> wrote:

Last night I was imaging with my QSI683 camera through the AP 130EDF on my Mach1GTO and had an unusual thing happen. I was on my last subframe of the evening, at around 2am and suddenly I noticed that the guiding errors grew tremendously.

I noticed the guide star was out of the field so I grabbed an additional full frame exposure through the guide camera to see what had happened. A 5 sec exposure showed stars streaking in the field of view, like the tracking was incorrect or even off.

After closer inspection I noticed that the mount parked itself at exactly 2:00am when the PC's clock automatically advanced from 2:00am to 3:00am during the EST to DST transition. It wasn't too much of a problem since I was closing down for the night anyway, so I lost the 10 min subframe.
I was wondering why/how the mount automatically parked due to that sudden time shift Any ideas? Anyone else had this happen to them?

Jim Fakatselis
Peppermill Skies Observatory
Huntington, NY


Imaging during EST to DST change over

Jim Fakatselis
 

Last night I was imaging with my QSI683 camera through the AP 130EDF on my Mach1GTO and had an unusual thing happen. I was on my last subframe of the evening, at around 2am and suddenly I noticed that the guiding errors grew tremendously.

I noticed the guide star was out of the field so I grabbed an additional full frame exposure through the guide camera to see what had happened. A 5 sec exposure showed stars streaking in the field of view, like the tracking was incorrect or even off.

After closer inspection I noticed that the mount parked itself at exactly 2:00am when the PC's clock automatically advanced from 2:00am to 3:00am during the EST to DST transition. It wasn't too much of a problem since I was closing down for the night anyway, so I lost the 10 min subframe.
I was wondering why/how the mount automatically parked due to that sudden time shift Any ideas? Anyone else had this happen to them?

Jim Fakatselis
Peppermill Skies Observatory
Huntington, NY


Re: Counter weight up slew vs. continuing past the meridian, any real differences?

Ray Gralak
 

Hi Luca,

My observation was that in theory starting from a CW up position saves imaging time, in practice I have found the
opposite because safety slews take longer.
First, the primary purpose of starting or ending in a counterweight-up position is not necessarily to save time but to be able to use the same guide star across the meridian. If you are using an off-axis autoguider without a camera rotator you may not get a good guide star (or any guide star) after a pier flip. But, if you have a camera rotator, using a separate guide scope, or unguided, there is not much advantage to counterweight-up imaging.

The precision I
require for the centering process is 30 points maximum error, which translates to roughly 20 arc-sec. If I am not
running a model on the Mach2 or the AP1100, the "closed loop slew" (to use TSX terminology) to the target will
usually take 2-3 slews. the first gets you with a degree, usually, and the second one gets you perfectly there or
If you are using an APCC pointing model, the declination pointing error should not be much less than the +/- 1/2 degree declination tolerance before a safety slew. If it is, then you probably should redo the pointing model, including adding more counterweight-up points.

If I allow APCC to run counterweight up slews within East limits and if the target is within East limits, when SGP
issues the first slew command to center the target, the mount will go in a CW up position with the scope on the East
side pointing East. When I have been next to the mount I have observed that the next slew or two to refine the
position of the mount and meet the required precision for centering the frame will be safety slews.
Again, a better pointing model should prevent safety slews, as exceeding the +/- 1/2 degree declination tolerance is unlikely unless SGPro is purposely moving the mount away from the target.

-Ray


-----Original Message-----
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Luca Marinelli
Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2021 3:17 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Counter weight up slew vs. continuing past the meridian, any real differences?

On Sun, Mar 14, 2021 at 10:07 AM, Ray Gralak wrote:


Hi Luca,



It's not a big deal either way; we are only talking about two or three slews per target. But then again,
neither is a
Meridian flip, which also take a couple of slews per target for plate solving. That was my original point.

Can you clarify? Are you saying that SGPro needs to slew two or three times in the course of platesolving a
new target, and in the process of doing this APCC is doing a pier flip and multiple safe slews for the *same* target?

-Ray


When I set up a target in SGP, I'll enter RA and DEC coordinates for the center of the image, as well as rotation
angle of the frame. I start the evening with a "closed loop slew" to use TSX terminology to the target. The precision I
require for the centering process is 30 points maximum error, which translates to roughly 20 arc-sec. If I am not
running a model on the Mach2 or the AP1100, the "closed loop slew" (to use TSX terminology) to the target will
usually take 2-3 slews. the first gets you with a degree, usually, and the second one gets you perfectly there or
almost. If I am using a model, depending on where the target is in the sky, it will take 1-2 slews to get there.

If I allow APCC to run counterweight up slews within East limits and if the target is within East limits, when SGP
issues the first slew command to center the target, the mount will go in a CW up position with the scope on the East
side pointing East. When I have been next to the mount I have observed that the next slew or two to refine the
position of the mount and meet the required precision for centering the frame will be safety slews.

The same holds for meridian flips. After issuing the slew command that triggers the meridian flip, SGP will run a
platosolve task to confirm the correct position of the target. Typically, it will then issue a second and rarely a third
slew to center the target with 20 arc-sec precision. The slews after a meridan flip will not be safety slews because
they are CW down.

My observation was that in theory starting from a CW up position saves imaging time, in practice I have found the
opposite because safety slews take longer. That's all I was saying. Again, this is an entirely minor difference and
overall minute contribution to overhead compared to time spent focusing, dithering, saving files, etc. If you relax the
precision requirement, obviously it will take fewer slew to get the frame centered. I image targets over the course of
several months and require this precision so I don't have to trim the edge of the frames excessively.

If there is a better way to set up APCC to reduce this time overhead, I am always looking for ways to improve how
the software works together.

Luca


Re: Which GTOCP* connection do you use?

Terry Martin
 

I use USB to the CP5. I have an Eagle 3 mounted on top of my scope.  Its 12 volt power comes from the through the mount power connection, which it then powers all the devices.  The USB from the CP5 feeds into the Eagle through the mount. I use a tiny portable router which just sits on the Eagle using Velcro. The Eagle connects to the router via ethernet cable and I remote into the router via Microsoft Remote Desktop (the Eagle WIFI is not very reliable). It all works really well. 

I run NINA via ASCOM and TheSkyX via ASCOM.

Terry


Re: Which GTOCP* connection do you use?

Frank Widmann
 

I have an industrial mini computer near the mount that has RS 232 ports that I use to connect to the mount.

Frank


Re: Which GTOCP* connection do you use?

Roland Christen
 

I use USB directly to the Cp4 and CP5 controllers in my observatory.
For camera connections I use whatever the camera came with - USB2, USB3 and even serial Stuck out tongue winking eye


My workflow to the Mach 2, using a powered hub is the following:

Connect MaximDL via ASCOM
Connect SkyX via ASCOM
Connect QSI683 WSG camera (160 EDF refractor) plus Lodestar guider
Connect Lodestar and Trius Pro 36 (130 EDF with Quad TCC)

Select object in SkyX and press GoTo. Stand back and let Maxim DL take images.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: cargostick@...
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Sun, Mar 14, 2021 8:28 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Which GTOCP* connection do you use?

A new poll has been created:
I am toying with connecting via ethernet to save a USB space on my control computer.  I have also ordered an FTDI serial adapter to try that out.  Therefore I should only need 1 USB cable to my entire imaging rig.  What are your connections and why?
1. USB
2. Ethernet
3. WiFi
4. RS-232
Do not reply to this message to vote in the poll. You can vote in polls only through the group's website.

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Re: Which GTOCP* connection do you use?

Elenillor
 

None of the above.

I use the "Keypad" as my control computer as a visual observer.
For connecting another computer I have successfully used all the other options.


Re: Which GTOCP* connection do you use?

KHursh
 

USB to RS-232 on a Mach2 (CP5) because I'm a creature of habit. I am in the backyard, but I don't need anything else. I don't trust WiFi in general and I have read that in particular the CP4/CP5 has drop outs. I have no need to run a cable (ethernet) all the way to the house. I DO connect to the PC via wifi so that I can control it via Remote Desktop.


Re: Which GTOCP* connection do you use?

Roger Howard
 

I have an ATS pier as well, and that is truly a lot of metal near a WiFi antenna. Today I used google Remote Desktop for the first time, so I plan to have my laptop on the home WiFi and remote into that laptop from inside the air conditioned house. Alabama summers are brutal, 90+ degrees and 80% humidity is horrible. 

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