Date   

AP1100 mount encoder and servos errors

Max Mirot
 

I am see/clearing frequent errors on the AP1100. 
I rebalance last night. It did not help.
Load is AP Honders and a camera.

Log attached

Suggestions?

Thanks 

Max Mirot


Re: Interesting Park using NINA

Dale Ghent
 


NINA just tells the ASCOM driver, essentially, "Park the mount". It's up to the driver and mount controller to get the mount into the park position that is configured in the ASCOM driver. NINA and other upper-level apps aren't aware of what the physical orientation of the park position actually is; they only know whether the mount is parked or not.

As for why your mount didn't land in the Park 3 position, looking at the AP ASCOM driver logs might help determine why. Perhaps you hit the stop button by accident. There could be a time issue at play, so make sure your PC's clock is accurate and that the "Sync mount time at initialization" and "Keep mount time synced to PC time" options are checked in the AP ASCOM driver's setup options. You can access this through the "Setip Telescope" utility or by pressing the gears icon next to the driver selection drop-down box in NINA. I'm not sure, but you may need to reinitialize your mount to get the time to sync. Of course you ought to ensure that your PC's own clock is fairly accurate and is itself synced to a time source, if possible. See the attached screenshot.



On Oct 7, 2021, at 13:59, michael mccann via groups.io <mmccawsprojects@...> wrote:

Hi
I believe the manual says try to unpark and park with AP Ascom or APCC.  Last night I started the mount and connected with NINA.  This was my first tracking session with this mount, so this a newbie making sure My process is correct. At the end of tracking M31, I used NINA to park to #3 the mount. Dec returned to correctly, RA was 10 to 15 degrees off, weights East.  So I then tried the AP Ascom to park.  The mount corrected and moved to park position #3.
So here’s the info to fill out the picture:
Software: 
NINA 1.11 - very recent version: I only used the simple sequence aspect of setting up a single target.
APCC - not installed yet 
AP ASCOM V2 - installed 
Keypad is attached and is configured for Ext.
You’ll Laugh:
Telescope: EVO50
Camera: ZWO ASI183MC 
Guiding 
ZWO MINI GUIDER w/ ASI290MM
PLATESOLVE: ASTAP
Process:
- Start mount 
- Start Nina 
- connect eqpt 
- set Nina to slew, and auto correct (platesolve)
- run a set of four settings, about 3 hours worth
- manually I used NINA to Park, in NINA park is set to position 3. 
*** this is where it didn’t fully move to park #3
This where I used the AP ASCOM V2 interface to park, which it did correctly.

So I was surprised that NINA didn’t park it correctly.  A side note, I did notice that when slewing to M31 it was several degrees out.

Any thoughts?

Cheers 







Re: Interesting Park using NINA

Roland Christen
 

When you're off by 15 degrees in RA it always means that your local time is off by 1 hour in that particular application. Could be time is wrong, could also be daylight savings is set wrong.

For every hour, RA changes by 15 degrees.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: michael mccann via groups.io <mmccawsprojects@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Thu, Oct 7, 2021 12:59 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] Interesting Park using NINA

Hi
I believe the manual says try to unpark and park with AP Ascom or APCC.  Last night I started the mount and connected with NINA.  This was my first tracking session with this mount, so this a newbie making sure My process is correct. At the end of tracking M31, I used NINA to park to #3 the mount. Dec returned to correctly, RA was 10 to 15 degrees off, weights East.  So I then tried the AP Ascom to park.  The mount corrected and moved to park position #3.
So here’s the info to fill out the picture:
Software:
NINA 1.11 - very recent version: I only used the simple sequence aspect of setting up a single target.
APCC - not installed yet
AP ASCOM V2 - installed
Keypad is attached and is configured for Ext.
You’ll Laugh:
Telescope: EVO50
Camera: ZWO ASI183MC
Guiding
ZWO MINI GUIDER w/ ASI290MM
PLATESOLVE: ASTAP
Process:
- Start mount
- Start Nina
- connect eqpt
- set Nina to slew, and auto correct (platesolve)
- run a set of four settings, about 3 hours worth
- manually I used NINA to Park, in NINA park is set to position 3.
*** this is where it didn’t fully move to park #3
This where I used the AP ASCOM V2 interface to park, which it did correctly.

So I was surprised that NINA didn’t park it correctly.  A side note, I did notice that when slewing to M31 it was several degrees out.

Any thoughts?

Cheers






--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Interesting Park using NINA

michael mccann
 

Hi
I believe the manual says try to unpark and park with AP Ascom or APCC. Last night I started the mount and connected with NINA. This was my first tracking session with this mount, so this a newbie making sure My process is correct. At the end of tracking M31, I used NINA to park to #3 the mount. Dec returned to correctly, RA was 10 to 15 degrees off, weights East. So I then tried the AP Ascom to park. The mount corrected and moved to park position #3.
So here’s the info to fill out the picture:
Software:
NINA 1.11 - very recent version: I only used the simple sequence aspect of setting up a single target.
APCC - not installed yet
AP ASCOM V2 - installed
Keypad is attached and is configured for Ext.
You’ll Laugh:
Telescope: EVO50
Camera: ZWO ASI183MC
Guiding
ZWO MINI GUIDER w/ ASI290MM
PLATESOLVE: ASTAP
Process:
- Start mount
- Start Nina
- connect eqpt
- set Nina to slew, and auto correct (platesolve)
- run a set of four settings, about 3 hours worth
- manually I used NINA to Park, in NINA park is set to position 3.
*** this is where it didn’t fully move to park #3
This where I used the AP ASCOM V2 interface to park, which it did correctly.

So I was surprised that NINA didn’t park it correctly. A side note, I did notice that when slewing to M31 it was several degrees out.

Any thoughts?

Cheers


Re: Possible bug in APCC with park?

Ray Gralak
 

Hi Tom,

I guess Voyager could have set a new park position but then why wouldn't apcc park at 3 like I requested?
My guess is that the mount was already parked in position near the zenith, so Voyager, seeing the mount was already parked, didn't try to park again. The mount could have parked itself at its current position near the zenith if you had shut down APCC for more than a minute.

-Ray

-----Original Message-----
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tom Blahovici
Sent: Wednesday, October 6, 2021 1:19 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: [ap-gto] Possible bug in APCC with park?

Last night from Voyager, I did a move to the zenith and stopped tracking so I could do flats. When they were
finished I attempted to park the scope. It reported it was parked. My usual location is park 3.
I closed out Voyager completely, and attempted to start tracking again.
Apcc reported the mount as parked. Pointing at the zenith.
I then did an unpark and tried a park 3 at the point. It went back to the zenith.
I had to use apcc, and then reopen it. Then. I could do a park 3.
I guess Voyager could have set a new park position but then why wouldn't apcc park at 3 like I requested?
Thanks


Re: APCC - APPM - and ASTAP

Ron Kramer
 

PNG files won't have the data (RA DEC) that FITS headers contain. 
Yes ASTAP is best and fastest.  Yes works with NINA and APPM.
I had some hiccups - I think bin2 was the answer.  APPM model is the best thing I've done for my Mach1. I no longer have to guide at all.  Tested up to 1000 second exposures.  I use to get trails or elongated stars over 40 seconds. 


On Mon, Oct 4, 2021 at 2:29 PM Jack Huerkamp <Mallincamusa@...> wrote:

I was not running the mount at all.  I was inside my house running ASTAP in stand alone mode on my home computer to become familiar with it.  According to the ASTAP site, it is possible to solve images by feeding them directly into the program.  That is what I was trying to do, and no matter what image I fed into the program, it failed to solve.  That is when I contacted Han at hnsky.org and he provided things to try to get the images to solve – and they did. 

 

Once I am out in the observatory and running ASTAP with APPM on my mount, scope and camera, hopefully all will work as designed.

 

Yours truly,

 

Jack

 

Jack Huerkamp

Jack's Astro Accessories, LLC

38388 Pine Street

Pearl River, LA 70452-5192

985-445-5063

mallincamusa@...

www.mallincamusa.com

30.37N  89.76W

 

All of us get lost in the darkness.
Dreamers learn to steer by the stars.

………………………………….Neil Peart

 

 

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of ap@...
Sent: Monday, October 04, 2021 12:24 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] APCC - APPM - and ASTAP

 

Jack Huerkamp wrote:

 

  • Mainly image scale, but putting a rough RA and Dec into the boxes so that the program did not have to search the entire sky helped a lot.  I assume that when running APPM with ASTAP, I will see the target RA and Dec and then I will be able to input them into ASTAP to help refine the plate solving.  I will find out once the skies clear here in SE Louisiana.

 

No,  you should not need to, the RA/DEC should be provided by the connection to your mount and/or by the FITS headers (not completely sure which, they both provide it).

 

If you were doing this running the simulator you should also connect to the same simulator in APPM and NINA.  Both NINA and APPM should have a connection to the (same) mount.

 


Virus-free. www.avg.com




Re: Seeking CP3 Control Box with V2 Chip

Chris White
 

I would be interested to know the answer, however you are correct... a pempro curve is not too tough to generate... and fun. 😀


Re: RA and DEC stiff after loosing Clutches AP1100

Max Mirot
 

Sure that makes sense.

I read the manual a year and a half ago. 
That how long I have been using this configuration without change to the scope or camera.

You saved me again Roland.

Thanks

Max


Re: RA and DEC stiff after loosing Clutches AP1100

Roland Christen
 

Yes, that's by design. For fine balance you need to use the gear lever to disengage the gears. But please read the manual! It is important to always release the gears ONLY at Park 3 position.

Roland

-----Original Message-----
From: Max Mirot via groups.io <titansmoons@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Oct 6, 2021 5:58 pm
Subject: [ap-gto] RA and DEC stiff after loosing Clutches AP1100

Both my RA and Dec no longer turn freely after loosing the clutches on my AP1100.
Another word it takes a little force or some lbs of misbalance for them to turn

What am I missing ? 

Max

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Re: #APCC #Mach2 - 3D viewer weird scope position while it is parked (or even while slewing sometimes) #apcc #APCC

Ray Gralak
 

APCC reads the mount’s mechanical position in both axes and returns that relative to each axis’ offset value to the 3DViewer. The axis offset value is what gets saved when the 3D viewer is synced. It’s incredibly straightforward and works the same way for ALL mounts. Nothing is different for the Mach 2.

 

An incorrect 3D position can arise if you move the scope manually and sync/recal the mount, or possibly when you home the mount. The solution is to resync the 3D Viewer after homing, moving the scope manually,  or unparking from one of the Park positions instead of the last-parked position.

 

-Ray

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Seb@stro
Sent: Wednesday, October 6, 2021 10:54 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: [ap-gto] #APCC #Mach2 - 3D viewer weird scope position while it is parked (or even while slewing sometimes) #apcc

 

Hi,

 

When I use the 3D viewer in APPC (which is a great feature), it seems to get de-synchronized from the mount position sometimes. Like in the example  below where the mount was parked at park 2 at around 9:30 AM (time of the screenshot is 12:30). 

 

One thing that might explains this is I do not quite fully understand what "correctly calibrated with the night sky" means in the warning window when the 3D viewer is launched. 

 

I would have thought "Find Home" (encoder tab) would be a valid calibration process for encoder mount in this regards. Or maybe the sync at the beginning of an APPM run, or from a third party software, but it doesn't seem to prevent that from happening, so obviously I'm missing something. My prerogative was that since the mount (with encoders) always knows where it is at, the 3D viewer should too, but it seems that at least in my case, it does not. 

 

From the manual, I understand this warning/pre-requisite is probably there for non-encoder mount when clutches are loosen but I couldn't find any information relative to this for encoder mounts or more specifically for the Mach2 (which is one of a kind species in itself, I know). But I might have missed it too. 

 

 

Hitting Sync -> Re-sync 3D view does fix it but it would be nice (and less scary, especially when slewing at 1800X) if it were always showing the correct orientation. 

 

Still, it works 95% of the time. Just trying to understand how I can get the last 5%... I can provide logs if required, but I feel it's just me not doing something I should. Anybody can pinpoint where I need to correctly "calibrate on the night sky", if that is indeed my issue ?

 

Thanks,

 

Sébastien

 

 


RA and DEC stiff after loosing Clutches AP1100

Max Mirot
 

Both my RA and Dec no longer turn freely after loosing the clutches on my AP1100.
Another word it takes a little force or some lbs of misbalance for them to turn

What am I missing ? 

Max


Re: Seeking CP3 Control Box with V2 Chip

Roland Christen
 

The way PEMPro works, you can store the curve on your laptop and load it onto the same CP4 at any time. However, when you change CPs, I would worry that the timing would not be the same. I will have to check with our servo engineer and get back to you.

That said, doing a Pempro run is actually fun, and the more you do it, the easier it becomes.

Roland

-----Original Message-----
From: Christopher Erickson <christopher.k.erickson@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Wed, Oct 6, 2021 5:37 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Seeking CP3 Control Box with V2 Chip

Every time a new CP3/4 is placed on a mount, a new curve has to be generated and stored in that CP3/4.

"My advice is always free and worth every penny!"

-Christopher Erickson
Observatory Engineer
Summit Kinetics
Waikoloa, Hawaii


On Wed, Oct 6, 2021 at 11:50 AM Chris White <chris.white@...> wrote:
Guess I have one more followup question.  If I make a PEC curve with the loaner CP4 will I ba able to keep that curve when I get mine back from repair, or will it require a new curve be generated at that time?

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Re: #APCC #Mach2 - 3D viewer weird scope position while it is parked (or even while slewing sometimes) #apcc #APCC

Roland Christen
 

I would have to let Ray take a look.

Rolando

-----Original Message-----
From: Seb@stro <sebastiendore1@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Sent: Wed, Oct 6, 2021 4:55 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] #APCC #Mach2 - 3D viewer weird scope position while it is parked (or even while slewing sometimes) #apcc #apcc #mach2

Here's what I get. Everything synced to the second (look at the Ottawa time on my cell phone).

When I attempt to check Location on the keypad, I get the following message: "Keypad in EXT mode". I did initialize the mount with APCC and just checked it too has the correct time & date and location as you can see in the screenshot.

So not sure what else I can have wrongly set. If it were a bad sync, it wouldn't get fixed when I click on "Resync 3D viewer", wouldn't it ? 

Just to make sure I'm making myself understood correctly, please notice that the scope position in the 3D viewer has been changing continously during all day, even if the scope is Parked right now and has been parked all day.

Anyway, I would have noticed such a big offset while imaging (successfully) at 2000 mm for the last three nights. I set everything up on monday, and weather has been cooperating since then so I have not touched a thing except perhaps refining PA (for at most +/- 10 arc-sec) from night to night.

Here's a link to my logs anyway:


Sébastien


De : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> de la part de Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...>
Envoyé : 6 octobre 2021 16:43
À : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Objet : Re: [ap-gto] #APCC #Mach2 - 3D viewer weird scope position while it is parked (or even while slewing sometimes) #apcc #apcc #mach2
 
Check your keypad time setting. It has to be the same as your computer time if you are going to switch back and forth between the two.

Roland

--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Re: Seeking CP3 Control Box with V2 Chip

Christopher Erickson
 

Every time a new CP3/4 is placed on a mount, a new curve has to be generated and stored in that CP3/4.

"My advice is always free and worth every penny!"

-Christopher Erickson
Observatory Engineer
Summit Kinetics
Waikoloa, Hawaii


On Wed, Oct 6, 2021 at 11:50 AM Chris White <chris.white@...> wrote:
Guess I have one more followup question.  If I make a PEC curve with the loaner CP4 will I ba able to keep that curve when I get mine back from repair, or will it require a new curve be generated at that time?


Re: #APCC #Mach2 - 3D viewer weird scope position while it is parked (or even while slewing sometimes) #apcc #APCC

Sébastien Doré
 

Here's what I get. Everything synced to the second (look at the Ottawa time on my cell phone).

When I attempt to check Location on the keypad, I get the following message: "Keypad in EXT mode". I did initialize the mount with APCC and just checked it too has the correct time & date and location as you can see in the screenshot.

So not sure what else I can have wrongly set. If it were a bad sync, it wouldn't get fixed when I click on "Resync 3D viewer", wouldn't it ? 

Just to make sure I'm making myself understood correctly, please notice that the scope position in the 3D viewer has been changing continously during all day, even if the scope is Parked right now and has been parked all day.

Anyway, I would have noticed such a big offset while imaging (successfully) at 2000 mm for the last three nights. I set everything up on monday, and weather has been cooperating since then so I have not touched a thing except perhaps refining PA (for at most +/- 10 arc-sec) from night to night.

Here's a link to my logs anyway:


Sébastien


De : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> de la part de Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...>
Envoyé : 6 octobre 2021 16:43
À : main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Objet : Re: [ap-gto] #APCC #Mach2 - 3D viewer weird scope position while it is parked (or even while slewing sometimes) #apcc #apcc #mach2
 
Check your keypad time setting. It has to be the same as your computer time if you are going to switch back and forth between the two.

Roland


Re: Seeking CP3 Control Box with V2 Chip

Chris White
 

Guess I have one more followup question.  If I make a PEC curve with the loaner CP4 will I ba able to keep that curve when I get mine back from repair, or will it require a new curve be generated at that time?


Re: Slight Wiggle in Dec Axis of Mach2 Mount

mjb87@...
 

I'd change the title of my earlier topic but can't see how to do it. If someone else can, feel free to do so.


Re: APCC feature request - Get time from mount

Keith Olsen
 

On Wed, Oct 6, 2021 at 11:00 AM, W Hilmo wrote:
I'm not sure what you mean by "they are both timed exactly".
What I mean is the GPS Status section UTC Time and my pc system time are exact.   I'm assuming that the UTC Time field in the GPS Status section of APCC Pro is getting the time from the MGBOX2 gps info and not from the pc system time.  


Re: #APCC #Mach2 - 3D viewer weird scope position while it is parked (or even while slewing sometimes) #apcc #APCC

Roland Christen
 

Check your keypad time setting. It has to be the same as your computer time if you are going to switch back and forth between the two.

Roland

-----Original Message-----
From: Seb@stro <sebastiendore1@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Sent: Wed, Oct 6, 2021 3:09 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] #APCC #Mach2 - 3D viewer weird scope position while it is parked (or even while slewing sometimes) #apcc #apcc #mach2

Correction: the mount is at *park3* right now (moved it with the keypad to do my flats this morning). Re-attached screenshot, so you can see in decent resolution. Maybe that is the issue (re-parking from the keypad) ?
 
Hi Roland,

Thanks for your reply. My computer is permanently connected to Internet and time is correct. 

One important thing I omitted in my previous message is that, at the time I park the mount, the 3d viewer shows the correct position (park 3). But sometimes, like this morning, it gets pretty obvious. It looks like the 3d viewer shows the mount is still tracking even if it is not. See for yourself below. I am positive it still is parked at park3 right now (and not at the position showed, obviously).

Sébastien


--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics


Re: #APCC #Mach2 - 3D viewer weird scope position while it is parked (or even while slewing sometimes) #apcc #APCC

Roland Christen
 

Nope. Makes no difference how you park it. Mach 2 ALWAYS parks the scope at the correct gear angle determined internally via the two absolute encoders. Doesn't matter where the park command comes from. Doesn't matter if it was sent to an errant position due to invalid sync or whatever, by any external client including the keypad.

APCC does NOT use the internal encoder park positions to determine the 3d Viewer orientation. It uses time and location to determine the mount's hour angle based on the last object that you synced to. Therefore the two can be out of sync by any of the three that could be in error (time, location and sync)

Roland

-----Original Message-----
From: Seb@stro <sebastiendore1@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Sent: Wed, Oct 6, 2021 3:09 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] #APCC #Mach2 - 3D viewer weird scope position while it is parked (or even while slewing sometimes) #apcc #apcc #mach2

Correction: the mount is at *park3* right now (moved it with the keypad to do my flats this morning). Re-attached screenshot, so you can see in decent resolution. Maybe that is the issue (re-parking from the keypad) ?
 
Hi Roland,

Thanks for your reply. My computer is permanently connected to Internet and time is correct. 

One important thing I omitted in my previous message is that, at the time I park the mount, the 3d viewer shows the correct position (park 3). But sometimes, like this morning, it gets pretty obvious. It looks like the 3d viewer shows the mount is still tracking even if it is not. See for yourself below. I am positive it still is parked at park3 right now (and not at the position showed, obviously).

Sébastien


--
Roland Christen
Astro-Physics

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