Date   

Re: Issue with DOVELM162

Cheng-Yang Tan
 

Will use Loctite if it comes off again. I tightened it up like what had posted earlier and by only tightening by 1/8 turn, the knobs haven’t come off ... yet.

On Tuesday, March 23, 2021, 4:19 PM, Woody Schlom <woody_is@...> wrote:

Cytan,

 

Nothing against your super-human strength claim, but I’d say your knobs weren’t properly done.  I just looked up red thread lock specs on both LocTite’s website and Permatex’s website.  LocTite says you need heat in excess of 550° F to loosen their red stuff enough to unscrew.  And they claim that without the heat, the bolt will usually fail and snap before the red LocTite lets go.  And I can attest to snapped bolts when I hadn’t properly heated it enough to fully loosen the red thread lock.

 

Permatex says their red thread lock needs to be heated above 500° F before it loosens up.

 

Both manufacturers consider their red thread lock products as “permanent” but that they can be loosened with enough heat.

 

If I were you, I’d just completely remove the knobs and studs, take the knobs off the studs, clean the threads (both internal and external) with alcohol or better yet, thread lock “primer” and an old toothbrush and Q-tip, let dry, and then apply some red thread lock to the knob end, thread the knob back onto the end of the stud, wipe off any excess while it’s still wet, and let it sit for 24 hours before threading them back into the dovetail saddle. 

 

You absolutely do NOT want any thread lock in the threads of the dovetail saddle.

 

Woody

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Cheng-Yang Tan via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 1:39 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Issue with DOVELM162

 

Then I'm really stronger than I look :) I had two bolts that that came off the knobs.

 

cytan

 

On Tuesday, March 23, 2021, 03:33:58 PM CDT, Woody Schlom <woody_is@...> wrote:

 

 

And red thread-lock needs temperatures above 600° F to start loosening up.  And my experience with the stuff is that it lasts for decades.  I have a trailer hitch that’s been outside for 20 years and the red thread-lock is still holding quite firmly.  I’m sure it’ll take a blow torch and impact wrench to loosen up.

 

Woody

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of George
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 1:31 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Issue with DOVELM162

 

Bryan,

 

Red Loctite is used.   One in a thousand will break loose when overtightened.

 

Regards,

 

George

 

George Whitney

Astro-Physics, Inc.

Phone:  815-222-6538 (direct line)

Phone:  815-282-1513 (office)

Email:  george@...

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Worsel via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 3:25 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Issue with DOVELM162

 

I wonder if A-P did use Loctite, then they consciously used blue Loctite, rather than red to ensure that, if needed, the Allen bolt could be removed.  Red takes very high temps to release.

Bryan


Re: Dolphin Head Nebula (SH2-308) - 15 degrees above the horizon

Karen Christen
 

Wow, that’s a beauty!  Thanks for sharing it with us!

Karen

AP

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of jypeng@...
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 5:08 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: [ap-gto] Dolphin Head Nebula (SH2-308) - 15 degrees above the horizon

 

Hello
I like to share one of the difficult targets I acquired recently.
This Mach2GTO was tracking (20 minutes guiding) my target very well just 15 degrees above the horizon. No modeling this time due to my model is all above 25 degrees above. 
Excellent mount, Great job, AP!
Thanks,
Jian Yuan Peng

 

Technical details:

Telescope: TEC 160FL + TEC FRC 0.9x

Mount: Astro-Physics Mach 2 GTO

Imaging cameras:ZWO ASI6200MM

Software: PHD2, PixInsight, Lightroom 6.4, Sequence Generator Pro, Photoshop CS6

Location: Palo Alto, California, USA

Total Integration: 26.8 Hours

PhotometricColorCalibration data(before crop):

Resolution ............... 0.392 arcsec/px

Rotation ................. -113.083 deg

Observation start time ... 2021-02-22 07:02:07 UTC

Observation end time ..... 2021-03-13 05:14:25 UTC

Focal distance ........... 989.28 mm

Pixel size ............... 1.88 um

Field of view ............ 1d 11' 25.1" x 1d 8' 12.7"

Image center ............. RA:  6 54 15.613  Dec: -23 55 29.32

 

Filters: Astrodon 50mm Unmounted LRGB Gen2 E-Series Filter Sets

Astrodon 50mm Unmounted 3nm Narrowband Ha, SII, OIII filters

Blue   35x60"   35 Minutes Bin1x1

Green  43x60"   43 Minutes Bin1x1

Red    36x60"   36 Minutes Bin1x1

Ha     12x900" 22x1200"   10.3 Hours Bin1x1

OIII   9x900" 37*1200"    14.5 Hours Bin1x1

 


--
Karen Christen
Astro-Physics


Dolphin Head Nebula (SH2-308) - 15 degrees above the horizon

jypeng@...
 

Hello
I like to share one of the difficult targets I acquired recently.
This Mach2GTO was tracking (20 minutes guiding) my target very well just 15 degrees above the horizon. No modeling this time due to my model is all above 25 degrees above. 
Excellent mount, Great job, AP!
Thanks,
Jian Yuan Peng
Astrobin: https://www.astrobin.com/7cldi1/
 
Technical details:
Telescope: TEC 160FL + TEC FRC 0.9x
Mount: Astro-Physics Mach 2 GTO
Imaging cameras:ZWO ASI6200MM
Software: PHD2, PixInsight, Lightroom 6.4, Sequence Generator Pro, Photoshop CS6
Location: Palo Alto, California, USA
Total Integration: 26.8 Hours
PhotometricColorCalibration data(before crop):
Resolution ............... 0.392 arcsec/px
Rotation ................. -113.083 deg
Observation start time ... 2021-02-22 07:02:07 UTC
Observation end time ..... 2021-03-13 05:14:25 UTC
Focal distance ........... 989.28 mm
Pixel size ............... 1.88 um
Field of view ............ 1d 11' 25.1" x 1d 8' 12.7"
Image center ............. RA:  6 54 15.613  Dec: -23 55 29.32
 
Filters: Astrodon 50mm Unmounted LRGB Gen2 E-Series Filter Sets
Astrodon 50mm Unmounted 3nm Narrowband Ha, SII, OIII filters
Blue   35x60"   35 Minutes Bin1x1
Green  43x60"   43 Minutes Bin1x1
Red    36x60"   36 Minutes Bin1x1
Ha     12x900" 22x1200"   10.3 Hours Bin1x1
OIII   9x900" 37*1200"    14.5 Hours Bin1x1
 


Re: Issue with DOVELM162

Woody Schlom
 

Cytan,

 

Nothing against your super-human strength claim, but I’d say your knobs weren’t properly done.  I just looked up red thread lock specs on both LocTite’s website and Permatex’s website.  LocTite says you need heat in excess of 550° F to loosen their red stuff enough to unscrew.  And they claim that without the heat, the bolt will usually fail and snap before the red LocTite lets go.  And I can attest to snapped bolts when I hadn’t properly heated it enough to fully loosen the red thread lock.

 

Permatex says their red thread lock needs to be heated above 500° F before it loosens up.

 

Both manufacturers consider their red thread lock products as “permanent” but that they can be loosened with enough heat.

 

If I were you, I’d just completely remove the knobs and studs, take the knobs off the studs, clean the threads (both internal and external) with alcohol or better yet, thread lock “primer” and an old toothbrush and Q-tip, let dry, and then apply some red thread lock to the knob end, thread the knob back onto the end of the stud, wipe off any excess while it’s still wet, and let it sit for 24 hours before threading them back into the dovetail saddle. 

 

You absolutely do NOT want any thread lock in the threads of the dovetail saddle.

 

Woody

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Cheng-Yang Tan via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 1:39 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Issue with DOVELM162

 

Then I'm really stronger than I look :) I had two bolts that that came off the knobs.

 

cytan

 

On Tuesday, March 23, 2021, 03:33:58 PM CDT, Woody Schlom <woody_is@...> wrote:

 

 

And red thread-lock needs temperatures above 600° F to start loosening up.  And my experience with the stuff is that it lasts for decades.  I have a trailer hitch that’s been outside for 20 years and the red thread-lock is still holding quite firmly.  I’m sure it’ll take a blow torch and impact wrench to loosen up.

 

Woody

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of George
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 1:31 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Issue with DOVELM162

 

Bryan,

 

Red Loctite is used.   One in a thousand will break loose when overtightened.

 

Regards,

 

George

 

George Whitney

Astro-Physics, Inc.

Phone:  815-222-6538 (direct line)

Phone:  815-282-1513 (office)

Email:  george@...

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Worsel via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 3:25 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Issue with DOVELM162

 

I wonder if A-P did use Loctite, then they consciously used blue Loctite, rather than red to ensure that, if needed, the Allen bolt could be removed.  Red takes very high temps to release.

Bryan


Re: Issue with DOVELM162

George
 

Cytan,

 

We won’t pick a fight with you!   <G>    Seriously, it is an easy fix…add a drop of red Loctite and wait at least 24 hours and they will be fixed.

 

Regards,

 

George

 

George Whitney

Astro-Physics, Inc.

Phone:  815-222-6538 (direct line)

Phone:  815-282-1513 (office)

Email:  george@...

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Cheng-Yang Tan via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 3:39 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Issue with DOVELM162

 

Then I'm really stronger than I look :) I had two bolts that that came off the knobs.

 

cytan

 

On Tuesday, March 23, 2021, 03:33:58 PM CDT, Woody Schlom <woody_is@...> wrote:

 

 

And red thread-lock needs temperatures above 600° F to start loosening up.  And my experience with the stuff is that it lasts for decades.  I have a trailer hitch that’s been outside for 20 years and the red thread-lock is still holding quite firmly.  I’m sure it’ll take a blow torch and impact wrench to loosen up.

 

Woody

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of George
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 1:31 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Issue with DOVELM162

 

Bryan,

 

Red Loctite is used.   One in a thousand will break loose when overtightened.

 

Regards,

 

George

 

George Whitney

Astro-Physics, Inc.

Phone:  815-222-6538 (direct line)

Phone:  815-282-1513 (office)

Email:  george@...

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Worsel via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 3:25 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Issue with DOVELM162

 

I wonder if A-P did use Loctite, then they consciously used blue Loctite, rather than red to ensure that, if needed, the Allen bolt could be removed.  Red takes very high temps to release.

Bryan


Re: APPM requirements

Jeffc
 

Speaking of “requirements”…

What’s the thought on using APPM with a non-permanent setup?

Fwiw, I’m using the mach2 now with an st8300m + fs128 at about 1040mm focal length and am “visually” seeing decent round stars with 5 minute unguided exposures.   

I’ve only had the mount for a couple weeks, but I also used the 130GT at 614mm with (iirc) 20 minute exposures unguided.

Yes, objects do not land in the center of the chip on a goto , but it is usually close enough such that I can plate solve , sync , then goto again (for proper framing).

I’m guessing APPM might help with longer exposures , and also with objects low on horizon affected by atmospheric distortion… the latter would be nice to correct for.  At this point I image objects when they are fairly high on the sky.

What would be the guidelines for a “portable” setup ?  
Eg 
a) create model at the site but it could be reused for the same location?
 b) or.. it is necessary to re-create model if the mount is moved.. ie polar alignment is re-done?

I’ve just wondered about the practicality for a non-permanent setup, and the conditions where APPM is needed for unguided imaging… eg the focal length where APPM becomes effective over just the encoders on a polar aligned mount..  Or is the benefit simply repeatable pointing accuracy?

Thx


On Mar 23, 2021, at 12:39 PM, Dean Jacobsen <deanjacobsen@...> wrote:

Ray's APCC/APPM on-line manual is a great place to start.

https://www.siriusimaging.com/Help/APCC/index.html

There is a specific section for APPM that I used to get everything set up.
--
Dean Jacobsen
http://astrophoto.net/wp/
Image Gallery - http://astrophoto.net/wp/image-gallery/
Astrobin Image Gallery - https://www.astrobin.com/users/deanjacobsen/ 
Amateur Radio Call Sign - W6DBJ


Re: Issue with DOVELM162

Cheng-Yang Tan
 

Then I'm really stronger than I look :) I had two bolts that that came off the knobs.

cytan

On Tuesday, March 23, 2021, 03:33:58 PM CDT, Woody Schlom <woody_is@...> wrote:


And red thread-lock needs temperatures above 600° F to start loosening up.  And my experience with the stuff is that it lasts for decades.  I have a trailer hitch that’s been outside for 20 years and the red thread-lock is still holding quite firmly.  I’m sure it’ll take a blow torch and impact wrench to loosen up.

 

Woody

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of George
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 1:31 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Issue with DOVELM162

 

Bryan,

 

Red Loctite is used.   One in a thousand will break loose when overtightened.

 

Regards,

 

George

 

George Whitney

Astro-Physics, Inc.

Phone:  815-222-6538 (direct line)

Phone:  815-282-1513 (office)

Email:  george@...

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Worsel via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 3:25 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Issue with DOVELM162

 

I wonder if A-P did use Loctite, then they consciously used blue Loctite, rather than red to ensure that, if needed, the Allen bolt could be removed.  Red takes very high temps to release.

Bryan


Re: Issue with DOVELM162

Woody Schlom
 

And red thread-lock needs temperatures above 600° F to start loosening up.  And my experience with the stuff is that it lasts for decades.  I have a trailer hitch that’s been outside for 20 years and the red thread-lock is still holding quite firmly.  I’m sure it’ll take a blow torch and impact wrench to loosen up.

 

Woody

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of George
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 1:31 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Issue with DOVELM162

 

Bryan,

 

Red Loctite is used.   One in a thousand will break loose when overtightened.

 

Regards,

 

George

 

George Whitney

Astro-Physics, Inc.

Phone:  815-222-6538 (direct line)

Phone:  815-282-1513 (office)

Email:  george@...

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Worsel via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 3:25 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Issue with DOVELM162

 

I wonder if A-P did use Loctite, then they consciously used blue Loctite, rather than red to ensure that, if needed, the Allen bolt could be removed.  Red takes very high temps to release.

Bryan


Re: Issue with DOVELM162

George
 

Bryan,

 

Red Loctite is used.   One in a thousand will break loose when overtightened.

 

Regards,

 

George

 

George Whitney

Astro-Physics, Inc.

Phone:  815-222-6538 (direct line)

Phone:  815-282-1513 (office)

Email:  george@...

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Worsel via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 3:25 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Issue with DOVELM162

 

I wonder if A-P did use Loctite, then they consciously used blue Loctite, rather than red to ensure that, if needed, the Allen bolt could be removed.  Red takes very high temps to release.

Bryan


Re: Issue with DOVELM162

Worsel
 

I wonder if A-P did use Loctite, then they consciously used blue Loctite, rather than red to ensure that, if needed, the Allen bolt could be removed.  Red takes very high temps to release.

Bryan


Re: Issue with DOVELM162

DiscoDuck
 

Thanks Robert. So Loctite would've been used originally by AP in manufacturing? I guess it degrades over time. The mount had been outside too for a few days (under a Telegizmos 365 cover) in some heat (not too bad ... we're into early autumn hear so the peak summer heat is gone).


Re: APPM requirements

Dean Jacobsen
 

Ray's APCC/APPM on-line manual is a great place to start.

https://www.siriusimaging.com/Help/APCC/index.html

There is a specific section for APPM that I used to get everything set up.
--
Dean Jacobsen
http://astrophoto.net/wp/
Image Gallery - http://astrophoto.net/wp/image-gallery/
Astrobin Image Gallery - https://www.astrobin.com/users/deanjacobsen/ 
Amateur Radio Call Sign - W6DBJ


Re: APPM requirements

Joseph Beyer
 

Ray has also created a YouTube video for APPM.  It’s intended for use with Sequence Generator Pro for camera control but essentially highlights the setup. Following the steps makes it quite simple. 

 

https://youtu.be/XwFbQTVIobM


Joe


Re: APPM requirements

Worsel
 

Ted

There have been a couple recent threads on building APPM models during bright moon times.  Here is one.  https://ap-gto.groups.io/g/main/topic/81388396

I do not think there is a max limit on focal length, as long as plate solving still functions.  I build models on a 2500 mm OTA with a full frame sensor / OAG and plate-solving is not a problem. 

Image scale may be more important.  The APPM section states
"If your image scale when binned in less than 3 arc-seconds/binned pixel then plate solve accuracy
will not be affected."



Bryan


APPM requirements

Ted Mickle
 

I would appreciate some guidance on how to set up APPM. I have an AP 1100GTO on an ATS pier that has been stabilized with three ratchet ropes attached to steel anchors imbedded 4 inches into a concrete slab.

I keep the mount and TAK f/7.7 TOA 130 covered with Telegizmos 365 covers when not in use.

Is this a stable enough platform to build reliable pointing models?

If so, can a reliable pointing model be obtained with illumination from the moon?

What is the maximum focal length recommended for use with APPM?

Thanks for your assistance and guidance.

Ted


Re: AP1600 - Intermittent Loss of Connection

 

Jack,

 

Reliability is more a function of how you set a system up, than of the connection method itself. In your observatory, you probably have an issue with something like a driver, faulty cable, or faulty adapter. In my opinion (and therefore completely open to disagreement!), there is no difference in reliability between USB, Serial and Ethernet, so long as you perform regular maintenance to your system and keep cables, adapters and drivers current. That said, there is no need to limit yourself with connecting a CP4; you can run commands through every port at the same time and the mount will be fine. APCC has a way to run a backup COM port, so you can do something like Ethernet + Serial in your observatory.

 

Liam

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jack Huerkamp
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 11:20 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: [ap-gto] AP1600 - Intermittent Loss of Connection

 

I have my AP1600 with CP4 connected to the observatory computer using a Serial cable and USB to Serial adapter.  I use SkyTools to connect to and control the mount.  Occasionally I get an error indicating that connection to the mount has been lost.  I re-establish the connection and all is fine.
Would using a CAT5 or CAT6 connection from the CP4 to the computer provide a  more reliable connection to the mount?
Can I have the mount connected to the computer using both a CAT cable and a serial cable?
If so, which connection takes precedence?

Yours truly,

Jack Huerkamp 


AP1600 - Intermittent Loss of Connection

Jack Huerkamp
 

I have my AP1600 with CP4 connected to the observatory computer using a Serial cable and USB to Serial adapter.  I use SkyTools to connect to and control the mount.  Occasionally I get an error indicating that connection to the mount has been lost.  I re-establish the connection and all is fine.
Would using a CAT5 or CAT6 connection from the CP4 to the computer provide a  more reliable connection to the mount?
Can I have the mount connected to the computer using both a CAT cable and a serial cable?
If so, which connection takes precedence?

Yours truly,

Jack Huerkamp 


Re: Mach2 intermittent loss of connection

mjb87@...
 

Same problem happened last night.

Thanks to all for the help.

Yes, I'm using TCP.

Ray has looked at my logs and thinks it is a timing issue. My data goes from mount via Cat6 to LAN switch via fiber to another LAN switch and then via Cat6 to the computer.  I will advance the timeout setting from 100ms to as much as 500ms, a bit over time to fine the sweet spot. I'll also set up the backup COM port using a USB connection. I can also take the second switch out of the loop if needed.

I'm using the brick power supply that came with the mount.  I also have the Powerwerx power supply, for now attached to my 1100. If the problem persists I'll use that power supply on the Mach2 and see if that solves it.

Once again, my thanks to this great community for their support and good counsel.

Marty


Re: Issue with DOVELM162

Robert
 

I'm not sure I understand your question.  The clamp isn't threaded so I'm going to assume you're talking about the knob, in which case, it is one piece.

Robert


Re: Help Parking AP 900 in TheSky #ASCOM_V2_Driver

Ray Gralak
 

Hi Bob,

Thank you, Ray. What ASCOM client application would work?
Any ASCOM client would work, but the AP V2 driver comes with the AP Jog utility, which would be a good choice.

-Ray

-----Original Message-----
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of Bob Gillette via groups.io
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2021 4:57 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Help Parking AP 900 in TheSky #ASCOM_V2_Driver #ASCOM_V2_Driver

Thank you, Ray. What ASCOM client application would work?

Bob

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