Date   

Re: Manage Cables Which Plate to Use for Top Mount Hardware?

Bruce Donzanti
 

Hi Alex

Glad the pictures helped.  I forgot to include the most important picture - that of the Linx Power Panel.  Without this nothing works.  

Bruce


Re: Manage Cables Which Plate to Use for Top Mount Hardware?

Terri Zittritsch
 

On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 01:37 AM, Dale Ghent wrote:

This arrangement worked well, but I didn't particularly care for the mess and weight and cables between all those little boxes and wanted an even cleaner solution. So I got a Pegasus Ultimate Power Box v2 and collapsed all 5 of those boxes into a single box that's a quarter of the weight and far fewer cables. The USB3 data and 12V power go to it. It opened enough space on the top so that I could mount a 2nd OSC camera+lens for widefield shots of what the 130GTX is imaging.
Hi Dale, do you feel you've lost any functionality with the Pegasus?  I am forever looking for a better solution.   

Hi Alex, I built up a aluminum plate with MDS dovetail connectors that I move from scope to scope, it's clean and contains power distribution, USB hub, dew control (dew buster) and focuser control(feathertouch) .. in all it weighs around 3 pounds.  I use the MDS because it's light and fits on the smallest scopes and what I use for my guide scope.    It's really not a lot of weight but I've put it to one side of the dovetail and it causes a bit of imbalance.  The mach2 handles this easily.       Thanks to Dale for pointer to printed stuff.    Can share a pic if interested.    

Terri


Re: Manage Cables Which Plate to Use for Top Mount Hardware?

Dale Ghent
 

I use a 14" Losmandy D plate on top of the rings, mounted inverted (keystone up), on top of my 130GTX. I did the same thing as you plan to - powerpole and USB hub, dew controller, a homemake temperhum-like device, and focuser controller mounted on that plate and everything wired to it, with only a single power and USB3 data cable coming off the scope and down through my mount (a Mach1GTO). I affixed those individual boxes to the D plate using 3M Dual-Lock that I trimmed to size for each component. I prefer Dual-Lock over Velcro because it's a tighter fit, doesn't collect garbage like the hook side of velcro does, and it's the same on both sides - you don't need to decide which side gets hook and which side gets loop.

This arrangement worked well, but I didn't particularly care for the mess and weight and cables between all those little boxes and wanted an even cleaner solution. So I got a Pegasus Ultimate Power Box v2 and collapsed all 5 of those boxes into a single box that's a quarter of the weight and far fewer cables. The USB3 data and 12V power go to it. It opened enough space on the top so that I could mount a 2nd OSC camera+lens for widefield shots of what the 130GTX is imaging.

Before:
https://imgur.com/TIhi45v

After:
https://imgur.com/IMmjlLO

After, with 2nd cam:
https://imgur.com/FLtLRo3

The UPBv2 handles the traffic from the QHY600M, QHY294C, and ASI290MM-Mini guide cam all running concurrently just fine.

If you don't need/want the weight of an aluminum plate on the top and just want a simple mounting surface for lightweight components, check out Joel's 3D printed stuff at https://buckeyestargazer.net/Shop.php

/dale

On Nov 5, 2020, at 3:09 PM, alex@mlcompute.com wrote:

Hello,

I'm waiting to receive my 130GTX scope (Several weeks) and I currently own a 1100GTO mount. Once I receive my scope, my goal is to mount all of my hardware for connections on top of the OTA. Basically, run two wires (One power, one USB) up through the mount and then have all of my connections to cameras, focus controller, Kendrick dew heater, etc. managed through a powered USB hub and a RigRunner mounted on top of my OTA. My question to others who have setup their systems in such a fashion is; what plate did you use on top of your OTA to mount the hardware too? As a side note, I own a small Tormach CNC milling machine I can use to tap holes in the plate for mounting purposes. My thoughts were to use threaded connectors to attach the hardware to the plate if applicable?

Thanks in advance for your advice,
Alex


Re: Manage Cables Which Plate to Use for Top Mount Hardware?

 

Alex if you are doing a  telescope-top plate with all your accessories, you might consider something like a pegsus astro Ultimate powerbox, which includes port-managed USB, power outputs, etc. very handy and compact box


Brian

On Thu, Nov 5, 2020 at 2:24 PM <alex@...> wrote:
Hi Bruce,

Yes, this is very close to what I had envisioned. I could mount the Losmandy plate on top of the scope rings and then mount my hardware to it.

Also, thanks for the pictures. They are very helpful. Looks like a 7 port USB hub? I'm trying to manage with 5 ports but not sure yet.

I like your observatory system. Someday, I plan on doing the same.

Best,
Alex



--
Brian 



Brian Valente


Re: Manage Cables Which Plate to Use for Top Mount Hardware?

Alex
 

Hi Bruce,

Yes, this is very close to what I had envisioned. I could mount the Losmandy plate on top of the scope rings and then mount my hardware to it.

Also, thanks for the pictures. They are very helpful. Looks like a 7 port USB hub? I'm trying to manage with 5 ports but not sure yet.

I like your observatory system. Someday, I plan on doing the same.

Best,
Alex


Re: Manage Cables Which Plate to Use for Top Mount Hardware?

Bruce Donzanti
 

Hi Alex

I attached a Losmandy plate on top of my C11" where all of the equipment is on.  I have one cable running from the main power supply up through the 1100GTO to the OTA where a LINX Power Panel is attached that allows power to be made available for all of the accessories like my Kendrick dew heater, including to a USB hub.   The USB hub cable then runs back down the mount to my laptop.  So, complete cable management through the mount.  The scope is on a pier 8ft above the observatory floor and this setup has worked fine for 2 years.  I think this is what you are talking about.

Bruce

On Thu, Nov 5, 2020 at 3:36 PM <alex@...> wrote:
Hello,

I'm waiting to receive my 130GTX scope (Several weeks) and I currently own a 1100GTO mount. Once I receive my scope, my goal is to mount all of my hardware for connections on top of the OTA. Basically, run two wires (One power, one USB) up through the mount and then have all of my connections to cameras, focus controller, Kendrick dew heater, etc. managed through a powered USB hub and a RigRunner mounted on top of my OTA. My question to others who have setup their systems in such a fashion is; what plate did you use on top of your OTA to mount the hardware too? As a side note, I own a small Tormach CNC milling machine I can use to tap holes in the plate for mounting purposes. My thoughts were to use threaded connectors to attach the hardware to the plate if applicable? 

Thanks in advance for your advice,
Alex


Manage Cables Which Plate to Use for Top Mount Hardware?

Alex
 

Hello,

I'm waiting to receive my 130GTX scope (Several weeks) and I currently own a 1100GTO mount. Once I receive my scope, my goal is to mount all of my hardware for connections on top of the OTA. Basically, run two wires (One power, one USB) up through the mount and then have all of my connections to cameras, focus controller, Kendrick dew heater, etc. managed through a powered USB hub and a RigRunner mounted on top of my OTA. My question to others who have setup their systems in such a fashion is; what plate did you use on top of your OTA to mount the hardware too? As a side note, I own a small Tormach CNC milling machine I can use to tap holes in the plate for mounting purposes. My thoughts were to use threaded connectors to attach the hardware to the plate if applicable? 

Thanks in advance for your advice,
Alex


Re: How often do you need to polar align a permanent mount?

Ron Kramer
 

I have a losmandy 3 legged stand in my dome with Mach1 on it. I might check PA maybe once a year. 

31919572_10213929061573497_129996823120052224_o - Copy.jpg

On Thu, Nov 5, 2020 at 8:36 AM Bruce Donzanti <donza2735@...> wrote:
I have a permanent setup in my Florida observatory- lots of sand base.  Cement pier goes from 4 feet below ground up 10 ft above ground where an adjustable steel pier is on top of it.  Then my AP1100 mount where my C11" EdgeHD sits.  Checking my polar alignment over the past 2 years, I've only had to adjust it 4 times using SharpCap.  Even at that, it has never been way off. 




Re: How often do you need to polar align a permanent mount?

George
 

To stabilize a concrete pier you need to run the concrete pier down below the worst case frost line and attach it to a footing. The pier is not a footing, it is a pier and it will move all around. A footing is an enlarged slab of concrete with rebar running into the pier. It is the only thing that stabilizes a pier.

My concrete pier runs down 5' to a 4' x 4' footing that is 10" thick (with rebar). There are some single pour pier footings that are heavy gauge plastic to which you add a sonotube.

Regards,

George

George Whitney
Astro-Physics, Inc.
Phone:  815-222-6538 (direct line)
Phone:  815-282-1513 (office)
Email:  george@astro-physics.com

-----Original Message-----
From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Dale Ghent
Sent: Thursday, November 5, 2020 6:57 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] How often do you need to polar align a permanent mount?


I think for the typical backyard observatory, it's going to come down to local soil type, local soil hydraulic nature, and weather more than earthquakes and faults. Even if the footer extends below the frost line, the ground swells and shrinks with seasonal changes in the water table and ground saturation.

On Nov 4, 2020, at 11:14 PM, CurtisC via groups.io <calypte=verizon.net@groups.io> wrote:

Picking up from Mr. Erickson's post -- Palomar Mountain is bounded by major faults on both the northeastern and southwestern sides of the block, and it is, of course, pretty close to the San Andreas and San Jacinto Fault Zones. The foundation of the 200-inch has adjustments for polar alignment, but -- to my knowledge -- it has never been readjusted due to effects from an earthquake. Nobody currently on staff remembers any such realignment. The mm 7.2 Cucapah Earthquake in Baja Calif. in 2010 was strong enough to slosh water in the observatory's water tanks, but it didn't affect any of the telescopes.


Re: How often do you need to polar align a permanent mount?

jimmyjujames
 

My 900GTO 10" Newtonian is on a permanent AP 8" portable pier on three
 14?" square stepping stones in vegetable garden with a 365 Telegizmos cover.
I attribute my changing polar alignment to moisture in soil.
If your soil has a high clay content, when dried out it will contract and leave cracks so that soil moves around.
But I'm lucky to be a maintenance man and enjoy minimizing polar alignment and orthogonality error.
Jimmy
Inside my head I have a good wolf and a bad wolf.
I was brought up to feed and nourish the good wolf.
I think everyone has a choice
 as long as they realize they have a choice.
 


Re: How often do you need to polar align a permanent mount?

Bruce Donzanti
 

I have a permanent setup in my Florida observatory- lots of sand base.  Cement pier goes from 4 feet below ground up 10 ft above ground where an adjustable steel pier is on top of it.  Then my AP1100 mount where my C11" EdgeHD sits.  Checking my polar alignment over the past 2 years, I've only had to adjust it 4 times using SharpCap.  Even at that, it has never been way off. 


Re: How often do you need to polar align a permanent mount?

Mike Shade
 

In SE Arizona at 5000' elevation, where we can have a pretty good heat cycle from day to night, I check and adjust polar alignment if needed once a year.  If there are any adjustments needed, they are small.  But remember metal can sag, fatigue, heat cycle, bolts can loosen up, fasteners can back off and so on.  I also go over all the fasteners on the OTA and make sure they are snug.  Generally in September after monsoon is over and prior to starting the new season.

 

Mike J. Shade

Mike J. Shade Photography:

mshadephotography.com

 

In War: Resolution

In Defeat: Defiance

In Victory: Magnanimity

In Peace: Goodwill

Sir Winston Churchill

Already, in the gathering dusk, a few of the stars are turning on their lights.

Vega, the brightest one, is now dropping towards the west.  Can it be half

a year since I watched her April rising in the east?  Low in the southwest

Antares blinks a sad farwell to fall...

Leslie Peltier, Starlight Nights

 

International Dark Sky Association: www.darksky.org

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of CurtisC via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, November 04, 2020 9:14 PM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] How often do you need to polar align a permanent mount?

 

Picking up from Mr. Erickson's post -- Palomar Mountain is bounded by major faults on both the northeastern and southwestern sides of the block, and it is, of course, pretty close to the San Andreas and San Jacinto Fault Zones.  The foundation of the 200-inch has adjustments for polar alignment, but -- to my knowledge -- it has never been readjusted due to effects from an earthquake.  Nobody currently on staff remembers any such realignment.  The mm 7.2 Cucapah Earthquake in Baja Calif. in 2010 was strong enough to slosh water in the observatory's water tanks, but it didn't affect any of the telescopes.


Re: How often do you need to polar align a permanent mount?

Dale Ghent
 

I think for the typical backyard observatory, it's going to come down to local soil type, local soil hydraulic nature, and weather more than earthquakes and faults. Even if the footer extends below the frost line, the ground swells and shrinks with seasonal changes in the water table and ground saturation.

On Nov 4, 2020, at 11:14 PM, CurtisC via groups.io <calypte=verizon.net@groups.io> wrote:

Picking up from Mr. Erickson's post -- Palomar Mountain is bounded by major faults on both the northeastern and southwestern sides of the block, and it is, of course, pretty close to the San Andreas and San Jacinto Fault Zones. The foundation of the 200-inch has adjustments for polar alignment, but -- to my knowledge -- it has never been readjusted due to effects from an earthquake. Nobody currently on staff remembers any such realignment. The mm 7.2 Cucapah Earthquake in Baja Calif. in 2010 was strong enough to slosh water in the observatory's water tanks, but it didn't affect any of the telescopes.


Re: How often do you need to polar align a permanent mount?

CurtisC
 

Picking up from Mr. Erickson's post -- Palomar Mountain is bounded by major faults on both the northeastern and southwestern sides of the block, and it is, of course, pretty close to the San Andreas and San Jacinto Fault Zones.  The foundation of the 200-inch has adjustments for polar alignment, but -- to my knowledge -- it has never been readjusted due to effects from an earthquake.  Nobody currently on staff remembers any such realignment.  The mm 7.2 Cucapah Earthquake in Baja Calif. in 2010 was strong enough to slosh water in the observatory's water tanks, but it didn't affect any of the telescopes.


Re: APPM + SGPro 4 - has anyone tried it yet

 

>>>I'm also using SGP 3.1, everything works fine so far and I don't want to experiment. 

same here.

afaik 4.0 doesn't have any new features that are of interest (not sure why it's labeled 4.0) but i'll look at upgrading when they add some

On Wed, Nov 4, 2020 at 3:02 PM Marcelo Figueroa via groups.io <marfig1970=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
I'm also using SGP 3.1, everything works fine so far and I don't want to experiment. 
 
Besides, we have to consider that version 4 is still a beta.



--
Brian 



Brian Valente


Re: APPM + SGPro 4 - has anyone tried it yet

Marcelo Figueroa
 

I'm also using SGP 3.1, everything works fine so far and I don't want to experiment. 
 
Besides, we have to consider that version 4 is still a beta.


APPM + SGPro 4 - has anyone tried it yet

Dean Jacobsen
 

I see that the 32 bit version of SGPro 4 has been released.

Has anyone who was using APPM linked to SGPro 3 for camera control and plate solving tried the new version yet?

I am still on SGPro 3.1 and I have no problem with my point mapping with APPM/SGPro 3.
--
Dean Jacobsen
http://astrophoto.net/wp/
Image Gallery - http://astrophoto.net/wp/image-gallery/
Astrobin Image Gallery - https://www.astrobin.com/users/deanjacobsen/ 
Amateur Radio Call Sign - W6DBJ


Re: How often do you need to polar align a permanent mount?

davidcfinch9
 

I had a concrete pier with eight foot footings. Polar alignment changed due to ground shifting (finally settled after about a year) and concrete differential shrinkage (continued for about four years).

The concrete shrinkage was the same effect observed in many observatories-including the Hale 200”.

David Finch

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io> On Behalf Of Peter Bresler via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, November 4, 2020 11:58 AM
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] How often do you need to polar align a permanent mount?

 

I have my 1200 on a concrete pier with 2 foot footings, rebar. Polar alignment periodically changes for reasons I am not sure off...it even could be small earth quakes here. I use Sharpcap Pro to polar align. I can tell its off when stars start moving with longer exposures. I probably need to adjust every few weeks.


Re: How often do you need to polar align a permanent mount?

Peter Bresler
 

I have my 1200 on a concrete pier with 2 foot footings, rebar. Polar alignment periodically changes for reasons I am not sure off...it even could be small earth quakes here. I use Sharpcap Pro to polar align. I can tell its off when stars start moving with longer exposures. I probably need to adjust every few weeks.


Re: How often do you need to polar align a permanent mount?

 

I just chatted with them just now, and they wanted to clarify they don't necessarily agree with a blanket statement "the more precise the PA the better"

Polar alignment error is only a problem when it creates image rotation and that’s pretty rare except for very wide field imaging.  That’s not really the same as saying “the more precise the PA the better” unless high accuracy just falls out from using PoleMaster or something. Or unless you’re trying to run unguided, in which case it matters a lot.

Brian

On Tue, Nov 3, 2020 at 7:51 PM Brian Valente via groups.io <bvalente=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
>>>" I have had one of the authors of PHD say that they prefer that the polar alignment is offset by like 8 arc-minutes.   Because if makes it easier to measure and compensate for a DEC polar error."


if you were experiencing significant dec backlash and their recommendation was to guide in only one direction, this offset PA advice makes sense. 


otherwise the more precise the PA the better for guiding. 


(I was a little surprised by this comment so i checked with the authors, and they confirmed my response)

On Tue, Nov 3, 2020 at 7:15 PM david w pearson via groups.io <p.davidw=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Not a clear cut answer to your question, as too many options that can be used to minimize polar alignment error affects.
I had a scope permanently mounted scope working at 1700mm with no encoders, but using PEC for 3 years and never had to realign after initially aligning to slightly less than 2 arc minutes
(Even had a small earthquake).
                  >Using PemPro or any other drift alignment process makes it fairly easy to achieve less than 2 arc-minutes.
But i could never do a 10 minute unguided exposure using Maxim DL, more like a max of 5 minutes.
I couldn't achieve 10min unguided until i did a pointing model with APCC.    And that doesn't last forever, meaning you have to periodically redo a model more than once a year.
i normally auto guide,  so I am not as sensitive to using an old pointing model, so that is the reason i don't update the pointing model very frequently.
I have had one of the authors of PHD say that they prefer that the polar alignment is offset by like 8 arc-minutes.   Because if makes it easier to measure and compensate for a DEC polar error.
Hope that helps
dave



--
Brian 



Brian Valente



--
Brian 



Brian Valente

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