Date   

locked Re: [ap-ug] To mask or not to mask, that is the question

Roland Christen
 

It takes a while to get used to it. Just like it took a year to begin wearing seatbelts back in 1960. But now it's automatic. I don't even think about seatbelts, they just seem to attach themselves.

Rolando Blush


-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Crisp <rdcrisp@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; robert-wynne@...; main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Sat, Aug 1, 2020 6:11 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-ug] To mask or not to mask, that is the question

I figure there are three scenarios of interest re: masks
 
  1. Preventing you from inhaling viruses
  2. Limiting the range of your phlegm
  3. Keeping you from touching your nose and mouth etc
 
I figure 1 is about like expecting chicken wire to keep mosquitoes out
#2 is reasonable and a kind thing to do for your fellow man (this is S.O.P. in Japan for decades btw) and #3 is a dead on BULLSEYE for me
 
It’s a constant battle for me to try to remember to keep my hands away from my face/eyes.
 
Not sure about you, but it’s hard for me to break habits that are going on their 7th decade!
 
 
 
From: main@ap-ug.groups.io <main@ap-ug.groups.io> On Behalf Of Roland Christen via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, August 1, 2020 3:31 PM
To: robert-wynne@...; main@ap-ug.groups.io; chris1011@...; main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-ug] To mask or not to mask, that is the question
 
Yes, maybe a fine point.
I wear one not for my own protection because breathing in doesn't prevent my getting a lung full of critters. My mask is for the protection of other people so that my phlegm and snot doesn't spray into the air when i sneeze or cough.
 
Our company was shot down for 2 months because of governor's orders, but now we are all working again. None of our crew has caught the virus, all of us wear our masks here at work when we have to interact or are within 10 ft of each other. Our small operation cannot survive if we get sick, so the mask is a small inconvenience.
 
Just heard the governor may shut our state down again because of a surge of rising cases. Hope not because right now we are going gang busters and want to produce and ship product. Our competitors overseas have no restrictions now and are eager to put US companies out of business. Is that enough reason to don a mask in public? I hope so.
 
Rolando
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: ROBERT WYNNE <robert-wynne@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...>; main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Sent: Sat, Aug 1, 2020 5:15 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-ug] To mask or not to mask, that is the question
Maybe this is putting too fine a point on topic without any humor; but from
N95 masks are designed to remove more than 95% of all particles that are at least 0.3 microns (µm) in diameter. In fact, measurements of the particle filtration efficiency of N95 masks show that they are capable of filtering ≈99.8% of particles with a diameter of ≈0.1 μm (Rengasamy et al., 2017). SARS-CoV-2 is an enveloped virus ≈0.1 μm in diameter, so N95 masks are capable of filtering most free virions, but they do more than that. How so? Viruses are often transmitted through respiratory droplets produced by coughing and sneezing. Respiratory droplets are usually divided into two size bins, large droplets (>5 μm in diameter) that fall rapidly to the ground and are thus transmitted only over short distances, and small droplets (≤5 μm in diameter). Small droplets can evaporate into 'droplet nuclei', remain suspended in air for significant periods of time and could be inhaled. Some viruses, such as measles, can be transmitted by droplet nuclei (Tellier et al., 2019). Larger droplets are also known to transmit viruses, usually by settling onto surfaces that are touched and transported by hands onto mucosal membranes such as the eyes, nose and mouth (CDC, 2020). The characteristic diameter of large droplets produced by sneezing is ~100 μm (Han et al., 2013), while the diameter of droplet nuclei produced by coughing is on the order of ~1 μm (Yang et al., 2007). At present, it is unclear whether surfaces or air are the dominant mode of SARS-CoV-2 transmission, but N95 masks should provide some protection against both (Jefferson et al., 2009Leung et al., 2020).
On 08/01/2020 2:37 PM Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...> wrote:
 
 
Hi Astronuts,
 
This is completely off-topic. My daughter sent me this funny video which attempts to answer today's most pressing question. What are masks for and do they really work? The video is funny and completely non-political. It's in the style of the old Myth Buster's TV programs where they were always blowing things up or burning them down. So, if you have a few minutes to spare, sit down and watch this:
 
Love ya all and stay healthy,
Rolando Kissing heart


Re: To mask or not to mask, that is the question

jimmyjujames
 

 
Thank you for the mask link.
Funny and makes a point.
 
I sent it to 19 family and friends.
Took a screen shot of hit count and 30 minutes later it had increased 9,000 hits.
It's going viral on the virus.

Thanks
Jimmy
Think Again!
 


Re: Moving to a new imaging laptop #APCC

 

I'm about to do the same thing, so I'm watching this thread carefully.

Mojo

On 8/1/20 10:28 AM, Dean Jacobsen wrote:
I am moving to a new imaging laptop in a couple of days and will be installing APCC Pro, ASCOM 6.4 and the AP ASCOM driver on it.

I found the hidden C:\ProgramData\Astro-Physics\APCC\ directory.

I wanted to move as many of the existing settings over to the new computer as possible so I don't have to go through and set everything up again.

I do a new model every time I set up so I don't think that I need to move the "Models"

So, this is what I think I should move from the C:\ProgramData\Astro-Physics\APCC\ directory:

- the HRZ file that is my horizon limits on the current computer,
- the two MLM meridian limits files that I created.  I assume that the default MLM file will be in the new installation already,
- the "Settings" document - replace the default document in the new installation with this one from my current computer.
- the same with the SiteList document

I don't think I need the "Backups", "Logs" and "Models" folders in my new installation.

Is there anything else that I need to transfer over to the new installation?

--
Dean Jacobsen
http://astrophoto.net/wp/
Image Gallery - http://astrophoto.net/wp/image-gallery/
Astrobin - https://www.astrobin.com/users/deanjacobsen/ 


locked Re: [ap-ug] To mask or not to mask, that is the question

Mike Shade
 

To add, data from 3M "Respiratory Protection for Airborne Exposures to Biohazards, Technical Data Bulletin Release 5, June 2020 #174" and "Respirators and Surgical Masks: A Comparison  Technical Bulletin May, 2020 Revision 4" offers that a standard surgical mask is not considered reliable protection from respiratory infections.  They do not filter the virus and they do not fit the face properly with gaps around the nose.  Additionally, they are designed to be used in a sterile field like an operating room.  They might help with "big chunks" from coughing and sneezing, but not for virus "floating" in the air, or airborne transmission  Of course a bandanna or some such is about useless.  They do offer than an N95 respirator will filter adequately.  Also, OSHA publication "Hospital Respiratory Protection Program Toolkit Resources for Respirator Program Administrators, May 2015" offers the same conclusions in regards to surgical masks and respirators.

 

Mike J. Shade

Mike J. Shade Photography:

mshadephotography.com

 

In War: Resolution

In Defeat: Defiance

In Victory: Magnanimity

In Peace: Goodwill

Sir Winston Churchill

Already, in the gathering dusk, a few of the stars are turning on their lights.

Vega, the brightest one, is now dropping towards the west.  Can it be half

a year since I watched her April rising in the east?  Low in the southwest

Antares blinks a sad farwell to fall...

Leslie Peltier, Starlight Nights

 

International Dark Sky Association: www.darksky.org

 

From: main@ap-gto.groups.io [mailto:main@ap-gto.groups.io] On Behalf Of uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, August 01, 2020 3:31 PM
To: robert-wynne@...; main@ap-ug.groups.io; chris1011@...; main@ap-gto.groups.io
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] [ap-ug] To mask or not to mask, that is the question

 

Yes, maybe a fine point.

I wear one not for my own protection because breathing in doesn't prevent my getting a lung full of critters. My mask is for the protection of other people so that my phlegm and snot doesn't spray into the air when i sneeze or cough.

 

Our company was shot down for 2 months because of governor's orders, but now we are all working again. None of our crew has caught the virus, all of us wear our masks here at work when we have to interact or are within 10 ft of each other. Our small operation cannot survive if we get sick, so the mask is a small inconvenience.

 

Just heard the governor may shut our state down again because of a surge of rising cases. Hope not because right now we are going gang busters and want to produce and ship product. Our competitors overseas have no restrictions now and are eager to put US companies out of business. Is that enough reason to don a mask in public? I hope so.

 

Rolando

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: ROBERT WYNNE <robert-wynne@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...>; main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Sent: Sat, Aug 1, 2020 5:15 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-ug] To mask or not to mask, that is the question

Maybe this is putting too fine a point on topic without any humor; but from

N95 masks are designed to remove more than 95% of all particles that are at least 0.3 microns (µm) in diameter. In fact, measurements of the particle filtration efficiency of N95 masks show that they are capable of filtering ≈99.8% of particles with a diameter of ≈0.1 μm (Rengasamy et al., 2017). SARS-CoV-2 is an enveloped virus ≈0.1 μm in diameter, so N95 masks are capable of filtering most free virions, but they do more than that. How so? Viruses are often transmitted through respiratory droplets produced by coughing and sneezing. Respiratory droplets are usually divided into two size bins, large droplets (>5 μm in diameter) that fall rapidly to the ground and are thus transmitted only over short distances, and small droplets (≤5 μm in diameter). Small droplets can evaporate into 'droplet nuclei', remain suspended in air for significant periods of time and could be inhaled. Some viruses, such as measles, can be transmitted by droplet nuclei (Tellier et al., 2019). Larger droplets are also known to transmit viruses, usually by settling onto surfaces that are touched and transported by hands onto mucosal membranes such as the eyes, nose and mouth (CDC, 2020). The characteristic diameter of large droplets produced by sneezing is ~100 μm (Han et al., 2013), while the diameter of droplet nuclei produced by coughing is on the order of ~1 μm (Yang et al., 2007). At present, it is unclear whether surfaces or air are the dominant mode of SARS-CoV-2 transmission, but N95 masks should provide some protection against both (Jefferson et al., 2009Leung et al., 2020).

On 08/01/2020 2:37 PM Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...> wrote:

 

 

Hi Astronuts,

 

This is completely off-topic. My daughter sent me this funny video which attempts to answer today's most pressing question. What are masks for and do they really work? The video is funny and completely non-political. It's in the style of the old Myth Buster's TV programs where they were always blowing things up or burning them down. So, if you have a few minutes to spare, sit down and watch this:

 

Love ya all and stay healthy,

Rolando Image removed by sender. Kissing heart


Re: large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Roland Christen
 

Here is some more information:
http://brayebrookobservatory.org/BrayObsWebSite/HOMEPAGE/PageMill_Resources/PUBLICATIONS/RA%20DRIVE%20RATES/RAREFRATE.pdf

Note, this covers only the RA drift rate. Dec drift will also always be there no matter how you polar align.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Sent: Sat, Aug 1, 2020 5:51 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

The RA tracking rate can vary anywhere from 35 to 70 arc seconds per hour (0.6 to 1.5 arc sec per minute) between the zenith and +- 3 hours from the zenith. The rate of drift is not linear. Modeling creates a drift curve for each point in the sky over the modeled track. The link below can tell you the actual tracking rate for different points in the sky:

http://www.bbastrodesigns.com/equatTrackingRatesCalc.html

These are approximate and depend on perfect polar alignment and not scope flex. In reality the drift can be worse if everything is not perfect. The calculations cover only the atmospheric refraction at nominal temperature and pressure.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Sat, Aug 1, 2020 5:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Hi Roland,
I always thought the refraction effect depends on latitude, but can be taken into account using the refracted pole.
do you think the effect is so  big at my latitude?
I leave and image at 42 deg north.

Or do you mean refraction due to altitude over the horizon?

In both cases, I don't understand why I need a model, unless you mean a model with different atmospheric parameters (i.e pressure and temp).
If these are not adjusted night after night , the refraction effect should be  a "factor" not requiring modeling.
It should be just calculated.
Am I missing something?
Thank you again,
Andrea


Re: large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Roland Christen
 

The RA tracking rate can vary anywhere from 35 to 70 arc seconds per hour (0.6 to 1.5 arc sec per minute) between the zenith and +- 3 hours from the zenith. The rate of drift is not linear. Modeling creates a drift curve for each point in the sky over the modeled track. The link below can tell you the actual tracking rate for different points in the sky:

http://www.bbastrodesigns.com/equatTrackingRatesCalc.html

These are approximate and depend on perfect polar alignment and not scope flex. In reality the drift can be worse if everything is not perfect. The calculations cover only the atmospheric refraction at nominal temperature and pressure.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Sat, Aug 1, 2020 5:35 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Hi Roland,
I always thought the refraction effect depends on latitude, but can be taken into account using the refracted pole.
do you think the effect is so  big at my latitude?
I leave and image at 42 deg north.

Or do you mean refraction due to altitude over the horizon?

In both cases, I don't understand why I need a model, unless you mean a model with different atmospheric parameters (i.e pressure and temp).
If these are not adjusted night after night , the refraction effect should be  a "factor" not requiring modeling.
It should be just calculated.
Am I missing something?
Thank you again,
Andrea


Re: large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Andrea Lucchetti
 

Hi Roland,
I always thought the refraction effect depends on latitude, but can be taken into account using the refracted pole.
do you think the effect is so  big at my latitude?
I leave and image at 42 deg north.

Or do you mean refraction due to altitude over the horizon?

In both cases, I don't understand why I need a model, unless you mean a model with different atmospheric parameters (i.e pressure and temp).
If these are not adjusted night after night , the refraction effect should be  a "factor" not requiring modeling.
It should be just calculated.
Am I missing something?
Thank you again,
Andrea


locked Re: [ap-ug] To mask or not to mask, that is the question

Roland Christen
 

Yes, maybe a fine point.
I wear one not for my own protection because breathing in doesn't prevent my getting a lung full of critters. My mask is for the protection of other people so that my phlegm and snot doesn't spray into the air when i sneeze or cough.

Our company was shot down for 2 months because of governor's orders, but now we are all working again. None of our crew has caught the virus, all of us wear our masks here at work when we have to interact or are within 10 ft of each other. Our small operation cannot survive if we get sick, so the mask is a small inconvenience.

Just heard the governor may shut our state down again because of a surge of rising cases. Hope not because right now we are going gang busters and want to produce and ship product. Our competitors overseas have no restrictions now and are eager to put US companies out of business. Is that enough reason to don a mask in public? I hope so.

Rolando


-----Original Message-----
From: ROBERT WYNNE <robert-wynne@...>
To: main@ap-ug.groups.io; Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...>; main@ap-gto.groups.io <main@ap-gto.groups.io>
Sent: Sat, Aug 1, 2020 5:15 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-ug] To mask or not to mask, that is the question

Maybe this is putting too fine a point on topic without any humor; but from
N95 masks are designed to remove more than 95% of all particles that are at least 0.3 microns (µm) in diameter. In fact, measurements of the particle filtration efficiency of N95 masks show that they are capable of filtering ≈99.8% of particles with a diameter of ≈0.1 μm (Rengasamy et al., 2017). SARS-CoV-2 is an enveloped virus ≈0.1 μm in diameter, so N95 masks are capable of filtering most free virions, but they do more than that. How so? Viruses are often transmitted through respiratory droplets produced by coughing and sneezing. Respiratory droplets are usually divided into two size bins, large droplets (>5 μm in diameter) that fall rapidly to the ground and are thus transmitted only over short distances, and small droplets (≤5 μm in diameter). Small droplets can evaporate into 'droplet nuclei', remain suspended in air for significant periods of time and could be inhaled. Some viruses, such as measles, can be transmitted by droplet nuclei (Tellier et al., 2019). Larger droplets are also known to transmit viruses, usually by settling onto surfaces that are touched and transported by hands onto mucosal membranes such as the eyes, nose and mouth (CDC, 2020). The characteristic diameter of large droplets produced by sneezing is ~100 μm (Han et al., 2013), while the diameter of droplet nuclei produced by coughing is on the order of ~1 μm (Yang et al., 2007). At present, it is unclear whether surfaces or air are the dominant mode of SARS-CoV-2 transmission, but N95 masks should provide some protection against both (Jefferson et al., 2009Leung et al., 2020).
On 08/01/2020 2:37 PM Roland Christen via groups.io <chris1011@...> wrote:


Hi Astronuts,

This is completely off-topic. My daughter sent me this funny video which attempts to answer today's most pressing question. What are masks for and do they really work? The video is funny and completely non-political. It's in the style of the old Myth Buster's TV programs where they were always blowing things up or burning them down. So, if you have a few minutes to spare, sit down and watch this:

Love ya all and stay healthy,
Rolando Kissing heart


Re: large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Roland Christen
 


Given the image scale and the typical sky condition here (over 2 arcsec FWHM),  I hope I will be able to avoid guiding without the model.
You can only get tracking without trailing in an area around the zenith, but only if you have the azimuth axis adjusted properly for no drift in Dec and the altitude axis adjusted for no drift in RA (in other words you have to drift align near the zenith). Everywhere else you will get drift because of atmospheric refraction. That is the purpose for modeling, to compensate for atmospheric refraction drift. It is quite large once you get +- 2 hours from the zenith.

Rolando


-----Original Message-----
From: Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Sat, Aug 1, 2020 4:43 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Hi Peter,
sorry, I tend to write too quickly and my english doesn't really support me :-)
I will try to clarify:

Q:You don't have OTA ready but still get drift in your images? How can you get images if you don't have OTA ready?
A: yes, I friend borrowed me a C8, a Vixen R200, and I have a nikon  with a 300m f4. I always had trailed images in dec, field rotation if guiding.

The new OTA is under construction and I am documenting its building here: https://andrealucchetti.smugmug.com/Astrophotography
There is just a page on tube construction for now but I should publish the design page in a couple of days
It is "my project", it will be a 200mm f3,9 corrected newton, corrected over 52mm (carbon tube, zerodur mirrors, Big paracorr, ATLAS focuser)

Given the image scale and the typical sky condition here (over 2 arcsec FWHM),  I hope I will be able to avoid guiding without the model.
I know it depends on several factors, mount, ota, etc.
From what I see, in RA I can already get perfect stars in 8-10 min. I said 10 mins to be on the safe side, but probably I could decide for 300s subframes working at f.3.9.
10 minutes is what I used for the 16803 with TEC140, which is f7.

Modeling is something I could do during winter or when I go for two consecutive days, during summer the night is unfortunately too short.
Let's see what I can do, I am ready to guide (MAch2 guides very easily in my opinion)if needed.
In any case I need to eliminate field rotation due to polar misalignment.

Thank you,
Andrea


Il giorno sab 1 ago 2020 alle ore 22:24 Peter Nagy <topboxman@...> ha scritto:
On Sat, Aug 1, 2020 at 05:51 AM, Andrea Lucchetti wrote:
Hello,
I need to polar align my Mach 2 very quickly to save time on field.
I thought Polemaster would have been a good choice but I cant get a good alignment with it (I am ways off)
The procedure goes very well, till the end, including the precise alignment step, but I have drift in my images.
running the Polemaster twice results in a small change.


I am not using the refraction calculation , as I leave at 42 deg latitude: can this be one of the reason?

my aim is to shoot 10 min subs unguided (@790mm focal and 1,6 arcsec/pixel resolution).

I still don't have my OTA ready so it is difficult for me to check with the drift method for the time being ( I can borrow a dslr and C8)

Would the RAPAS be a better solution for my needs? 
I understand it can be mounted on the MACH2 using a dovetail, with repeatable accuracy.
Is the accuracy enough for imaging and how it compares to Polemaster?

Thank you,
Andrea
Andrea,

Your original post message is a little confusing.

First you said:

"The procedure goes very well, till the end, including the precise alignment step, but I have drift in my images."

then you said:

"my aim is to shoot 10 min subs unguided (@790mm focal and 1,6 arcsec/pixel resolution).

I still don't have my OTA ready so it is difficult for me to check with the drift method for the time being ( I can borrow a dslr and C8)"

You don't have OTA ready but still get drift in your images? How can you get images if you don't have OTA ready?

What scope were you using that's giving you drift and are you trying to image unguided? Also you said you are aiming for unguided imaging at 790mm focal length which can be very hard to do assuming you are not using pointing model with APCC-Pro. Are you using pointing model yet? If not, I would not expect absolute encoder alone to get pinpoint stars without the help of pointing model even with perfect polar alignment due to many external variables like refraction in the sky, flexure, etc.

So, if you polar align using PoleMaster and its software and use guiding, then I would expect excellent images. Like others said, I would prefer Sharp Cap Pro as well as it's not only accurate but super easy to use. If you already have PoleMaster, then you may not need RAPAS because PoleMaster with Sharp Cap Pro is really good and quick.

Can you clarify your original message a bit more?

Peter


Re: large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Andrea Lucchetti
 

Hi Peter,
sorry, I tend to write too quickly and my english doesn't really support me :-)
I will try to clarify:

Q:You don't have OTA ready but still get drift in your images? How can you get images if you don't have OTA ready?
A: yes, I friend borrowed me a C8, a Vixen R200, and I have a nikon  with a 300m f4. I always had trailed images in dec, field rotation if guiding.

The new OTA is under construction and I am documenting its building here: https://andrealucchetti.smugmug.com/Astrophotography
There is just a page on tube construction for now but I should publish the design page in a couple of days
It is "my project", it will be a 200mm f3,9 corrected newton, corrected over 52mm (carbon tube, zerodur mirrors, Big paracorr, ATLAS focuser)

Given the image scale and the typical sky condition here (over 2 arcsec FWHM),  I hope I will be able to avoid guiding without the model.
I know it depends on several factors, mount, ota, etc.
From what I see, in RA I can already get perfect stars in 8-10 min. I said 10 mins to be on the safe side, but probably I could decide for 300s subframes working at f.3.9.
10 minutes is what I used for the 16803 with TEC140, which is f7.

Modeling is something I could do during winter or when I go for two consecutive days, during summer the night is unfortunately too short.
Let's see what I can do, I am ready to guide (MAch2 guides very easily in my opinion)if needed.
In any case I need to eliminate field rotation due to polar misalignment.

Thank you,
Andrea


Il giorno sab 1 ago 2020 alle ore 22:24 Peter Nagy <topboxman@...> ha scritto:
On Sat, Aug 1, 2020 at 05:51 AM, Andrea Lucchetti wrote:
Hello,
I need to polar align my Mach 2 very quickly to save time on field.
I thought Polemaster would have been a good choice but I cant get a good alignment with it (I am ways off)
The procedure goes very well, till the end, including the precise alignment step, but I have drift in my images.
running the Polemaster twice results in a small change.


I am not using the refraction calculation , as I leave at 42 deg latitude: can this be one of the reason?

my aim is to shoot 10 min subs unguided (@790mm focal and 1,6 arcsec/pixel resolution).

I still don't have my OTA ready so it is difficult for me to check with the drift method for the time being ( I can borrow a dslr and C8)

Would the RAPAS be a better solution for my needs? 
I understand it can be mounted on the MACH2 using a dovetail, with repeatable accuracy.
Is the accuracy enough for imaging and how it compares to Polemaster?

Thank you,
Andrea
Andrea,

Your original post message is a little confusing.

First you said:

"The procedure goes very well, till the end, including the precise alignment step, but I have drift in my images."

then you said:

"my aim is to shoot 10 min subs unguided (@790mm focal and 1,6 arcsec/pixel resolution).

I still don't have my OTA ready so it is difficult for me to check with the drift method for the time being ( I can borrow a dslr and C8)"

You don't have OTA ready but still get drift in your images? How can you get images if you don't have OTA ready?

What scope were you using that's giving you drift and are you trying to image unguided? Also you said you are aiming for unguided imaging at 790mm focal length which can be very hard to do assuming you are not using pointing model with APCC-Pro. Are you using pointing model yet? If not, I would not expect absolute encoder alone to get pinpoint stars without the help of pointing model even with perfect polar alignment due to many external variables like refraction in the sky, flexure, etc.

So, if you polar align using PoleMaster and its software and use guiding, then I would expect excellent images. Like others said, I would prefer Sharp Cap Pro as well as it's not only accurate but super easy to use. If you already have PoleMaster, then you may not need RAPAS because PoleMaster with Sharp Cap Pro is really good and quick.

Can you clarify your original message a bit more?

Peter


To mask or not to mask, that is the question

Roland Christen
 

Hi Astronuts,

This is completely off-topic. My daughter sent me this funny video which attempts to answer today's most pressing question. What are masks for and do they really work? The video is funny and completely non-political. It's in the style of the old Myth Buster's TV programs where they were always blowing things up or burning them down. So, if you have a few minutes to spare, sit down and watch this:

Love ya all and stay healthy,
Rolando Kissing heart


Re: Planet Tracking and Imaging #Mach2GTO #APCC

Roland Christen
 

The keypad always had the latest data for planets.
Where it was lacking was in the data for stars which lacked the extra decimal points for the highest precision and also lacked calculations for precession.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Greg Vaughn <gregvaughn@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Sat, Aug 1, 2020 4:08 pm
Subject: Re: [ap-gto] Planet Tracking and Imaging

Thanks, Roland.
 
I’ve been watching Christopher Go post his images over the years and have regarded them with a great deal of envy.
 
From a presentation he gave for Woodland Hills, it seems he uses an LRGB approach with a monochrome camera and registers everything using WinJUPOS, which I haven’t used yet.   But when you add up 30 sec for each filter and recognize he takes several groups, it ends up being a healthy amount of time.  (I should probably send this question to him!)
 
However, I thought I had remembered comments posted (by you?) about the planetarium program in the keypad not being quite up to snuff with the latest data for planets. I think it was one of the items that was to be upgraded in the new firmware/software.  My question for Ray was whether uploading ephemeris data for the planets would provide a measurable improvement in the pointing and tracking of the planets at long focal lengths.   And, as a bonus question, how did this play with the APPM modeling – which I believe is principally focused on star pointing and tracking.
 
You can tell we have bad weather here, or otherwise I’d be out there answering these question for myself with some theory to practice evolutions.
 
Thanks in advance for your consideration and thoughts!
 
Best wishes for good health and clear skies!
 
Cheers,
Greg
 
p.s.   I do believe all of my planet imaging issues would be solved with an AP 10” Maksutov-Cassegrain telescope!  I’m sure that that last one in the photos you posted, Roland, has my name on it.  I think, however, during the pandemic you all at AP may have just lost my email and snail mail addresses and misplaced my phone number.  I’m patiently standing by! J J   To be fair, I’m delighted to have received a Mach 2 and have my hands full (when the skies are clear).

Virus-free. www.avast.com


Re: large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Jim Hawn
 

You indicated:
"I need to polar align my Mach 2 very quickly"

To echo what many others have indicated, consider using the RAPAS to initially polar align.  With a little practice, this takes about two minutes.
Following initial PA, take advantage of Sharpcap Pro's polar alignment.  With a little practice, you can achieve a <1' polar alignment in about two minutes.
Thus, in less than approximately five minutes from start-to-finish, your Mach2 is decently polar aligned.  Add a minute or two if you want to fine tune to <10".
I'm reporting from experience, not conjecture.
If you define "very quickly" as 4-5 minutes, perhaps this is a solution for you to consider.

-  Jim


Re: large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Andrea Lucchetti
 

thank you!
need to check the location I entered in Polemaster software too!
that could be the simple reason for my problem...

Il giorno sab 1 ago 2020 alle ore 20:52 Brian Valente <bvalente@...> ha scritto:
>>>I will give a chance to the pole master+SC software.

in my experience it works fantastically well

one note: make sure you enter the setup information correctly in Sharpcap. It's not clear but you need to ensure you enter your location/date/time and also your image scale. it doesn't really warn you about that



On Sat, Aug 1, 2020 at 11:42 AM Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@...> wrote:
Thank you, 
I will give a chance to the pole master+SC software.
If it doesn’t work , I will probably go for the Rapas.
Andrea

Il giorno sab 1 ago 2020 alle 16:41 uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> ha scritto:
The Rapas will require you to drift align the mount for the first time. Then you adjust the Rapas precisely using the 3 push-pull screws. From then on you can get good polar alignment using the pole scope without having to do any other alignment.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Sat, Aug 1, 2020 7:51 am
Subject: [ap-gto] large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Hello,
I need to polar align my Mach 2 very quickly to save time on field.
I thought Polemaster would have been a good choice but I cant get a good alignment with it (I am ways off)
The procedure goes very well, till the end, including the precise alignment step, but I have drift in my images.
running the Polemaster twice results in a small change.


I am not using the refraction calculation , as I leave at 42 deg latitude: can this be one of the reason?

my aim is to shoot 10 min subs unguided (@790mm focal and 1,6 arcsec/pixel resolution).

I still don't have my OTA ready so it is difficult for me to check with the drift method for the time being ( I can borrow a dslr and C8)

Would the RAPAS be a better solution for my needs? 
I understand it can be mounted on the MACH2 using a dovetail, with repeatable accuracy.
Is the accuracy enough for imaging and how it compares to Polemaster?

Thank you,
Andrea



--
Brian 



Brian Valente


Re: Planet Tracking and Imaging #Mach2GTO #APCC

Greg Vaughn
 

Thanks, Roland.

 

I’ve been watching Christopher Go post his images over the years and have regarded them with a great deal of envy.

 

From a presentation he gave for Woodland Hills, it seems he uses an LRGB approach with a monochrome camera and registers everything using WinJUPOS, which I haven’t used yet.   But when you add up 30 sec for each filter and recognize he takes several groups, it ends up being a healthy amount of time.  (I should probably send this question to him!)

 

However, I thought I had remembered comments posted (by you?) about the planetarium program in the keypad not being quite up to snuff with the latest data for planets. I think it was one of the items that was to be upgraded in the new firmware/software.  My question for Ray was whether uploading ephemeris data for the planets would provide a measurable improvement in the pointing and tracking of the planets at long focal lengths.   And, as a bonus question, how did this play with the APPM modeling – which I believe is principally focused on star pointing and tracking.

 

You can tell we have bad weather here, or otherwise I’d be out there answering these question for myself with some theory to practice evolutions.

 

Thanks in advance for your consideration and thoughts!

 

Best wishes for good health and clear skies!

 

Cheers,

Greg

 

p.s.   I do believe all of my planet imaging issues would be solved with an AP 10” Maksutov-Cassegrain telescope!  I’m sure that that last one in the photos you posted, Roland, has my name on it.  I think, however, during the pandemic you all at AP may have just lost my email and snail mail addresses and misplaced my phone number.  I’m patiently standing by! J J   To be fair, I’m delighted to have received a Mach 2 and have my hands full (when the skies are clear).


Virus-free. www.avast.com


Pelican Nebula and M33

Robert Chozick <rchozick@...>
 

I got a few more images from my test trip for my new ASI2600 CMOS color camera. 

Pelican Nebula

The bright stars in the Pelican got blown out and really unfixable with the shorter exposure subs so I learned that 5 min at f5 is too much with this camera when bright stars are present.  There was also a reflection in the right upper corner that I think I can fix by bringing the UV-IR filter closer to the sensor.  On the FSQ the CA-35 camera adapter allows a 2 inch filter to be screwed in but it is 30-40mm away from the sensor.  I am getting a ZWO filter drawer to bring it closer.  Hopefully that will fix it. 


M33

I needed more data on M33 and some Ha but I was surprised at the quality of the data for only 2.5 hours.


I need to try to always get more data on images.  In the past I have wanted to get a lot of images on every trip since it is so rare I go but I am going to try to get at least 5-6 hours of data at f5 and 8-12 hours at f8 from now on.

Robert Chozick




Re: large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Marcelo Figueroa
 

I've used the polemaster with my Mach1 the last couple of years without any problem (I haven't been able to test the Mach2 yet, it's winter here).  A couple of things to keep in mind:
 
- Make sure that looking at the mount from the front, the USB connector of the polemaster is pointing to the left.
 
- Did you perform the procedure with all the equipment mounted? If it is done without the equipment, adding the extra weight later may introduce small changes.
 

You can also try the PHD2 polar alignment procedures (3 in fact, Drift, Polar Drift Align and Static Polar Align) which is free.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCHQmpnADKMQ5k87pa8yx_Eg
 
 


Re: large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Peter Nagy
 

On Sat, Aug 1, 2020 at 05:51 AM, Andrea Lucchetti wrote:
Hello,
I need to polar align my Mach 2 very quickly to save time on field.
I thought Polemaster would have been a good choice but I cant get a good alignment with it (I am ways off)
The procedure goes very well, till the end, including the precise alignment step, but I have drift in my images.
running the Polemaster twice results in a small change.


I am not using the refraction calculation , as I leave at 42 deg latitude: can this be one of the reason?

my aim is to shoot 10 min subs unguided (@790mm focal and 1,6 arcsec/pixel resolution).

I still don't have my OTA ready so it is difficult for me to check with the drift method for the time being ( I can borrow a dslr and C8)

Would the RAPAS be a better solution for my needs? 
I understand it can be mounted on the MACH2 using a dovetail, with repeatable accuracy.
Is the accuracy enough for imaging and how it compares to Polemaster?

Thank you,
Andrea
Andrea,

Your original post message is a little confusing.

First you said:

"The procedure goes very well, till the end, including the precise alignment step, but I have drift in my images."

then you said:

"my aim is to shoot 10 min subs unguided (@790mm focal and 1,6 arcsec/pixel resolution).

I still don't have my OTA ready so it is difficult for me to check with the drift method for the time being ( I can borrow a dslr and C8)"

You don't have OTA ready but still get drift in your images? How can you get images if you don't have OTA ready?

What scope were you using that's giving you drift and are you trying to image unguided? Also you said you are aiming for unguided imaging at 790mm focal length which can be very hard to do assuming you are not using pointing model with APCC-Pro. Are you using pointing model yet? If not, I would not expect absolute encoder alone to get pinpoint stars without the help of pointing model even with perfect polar alignment due to many external variables like refraction in the sky, flexure, etc.

So, if you polar align using PoleMaster and its software and use guiding, then I would expect excellent images. Like others said, I would prefer Sharp Cap Pro as well as it's not only accurate but super easy to use. If you already have PoleMaster, then you may not need RAPAS because PoleMaster with Sharp Cap Pro is really good and quick.

Can you clarify your original message a bit more?

Peter


Re: large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Bruce Donzanti
 

agree- PM + SC works great; simple, fast and accurate as long as you are within 5 degrees of Polaris so the internal plate solver can work

On Sat, Aug 1, 2020 at 2:52 PM Brian Valente <bvalente@...> wrote:
>>>I will give a chance to the pole master+SC software.

in my experience it works fantastically well

one note: make sure you enter the setup information correctly in Sharpcap. It's not clear but you need to ensure you enter your location/date/time and also your image scale. it doesn't really warn you about that



On Sat, Aug 1, 2020 at 11:42 AM Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@...> wrote:
Thank you, 
I will give a chance to the pole master+SC software.
If it doesn’t work , I will probably go for the Rapas.
Andrea

Il giorno sab 1 ago 2020 alle 16:41 uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> ha scritto:
The Rapas will require you to drift align the mount for the first time. Then you adjust the Rapas precisely using the 3 push-pull screws. From then on you can get good polar alignment using the pole scope without having to do any other alignment.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Sat, Aug 1, 2020 7:51 am
Subject: [ap-gto] large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Hello,
I need to polar align my Mach 2 very quickly to save time on field.
I thought Polemaster would have been a good choice but I cant get a good alignment with it (I am ways off)
The procedure goes very well, till the end, including the precise alignment step, but I have drift in my images.
running the Polemaster twice results in a small change.


I am not using the refraction calculation , as I leave at 42 deg latitude: can this be one of the reason?

my aim is to shoot 10 min subs unguided (@790mm focal and 1,6 arcsec/pixel resolution).

I still don't have my OTA ready so it is difficult for me to check with the drift method for the time being ( I can borrow a dslr and C8)

Would the RAPAS be a better solution for my needs? 
I understand it can be mounted on the MACH2 using a dovetail, with repeatable accuracy.
Is the accuracy enough for imaging and how it compares to Polemaster?

Thank you,
Andrea



--
Brian 



Brian Valente


Re: large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

 

>>>I will give a chance to the pole master+SC software.

in my experience it works fantastically well

one note: make sure you enter the setup information correctly in Sharpcap. It's not clear but you need to ensure you enter your location/date/time and also your image scale. it doesn't really warn you about that



On Sat, Aug 1, 2020 at 11:42 AM Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@...> wrote:
Thank you, 
I will give a chance to the pole master+SC software.
If it doesn’t work , I will probably go for the Rapas.
Andrea

Il giorno sab 1 ago 2020 alle 16:41 uncarollo2 <chris1011@...> via groups.io <chris1011=aol.com@groups.io> ha scritto:
The Rapas will require you to drift align the mount for the first time. Then you adjust the Rapas precisely using the 3 push-pull screws. From then on you can get good polar alignment using the pole scope without having to do any other alignment.

Rolando



-----Original Message-----
From: Andrea Lucchetti <andlucchett@...>
To: main@ap-gto.groups.io
Sent: Sat, Aug 1, 2020 7:51 am
Subject: [ap-gto] large alignment error with polemaster & mach2

Hello,
I need to polar align my Mach 2 very quickly to save time on field.
I thought Polemaster would have been a good choice but I cant get a good alignment with it (I am ways off)
The procedure goes very well, till the end, including the precise alignment step, but I have drift in my images.
running the Polemaster twice results in a small change.


I am not using the refraction calculation , as I leave at 42 deg latitude: can this be one of the reason?

my aim is to shoot 10 min subs unguided (@790mm focal and 1,6 arcsec/pixel resolution).

I still don't have my OTA ready so it is difficult for me to check with the drift method for the time being ( I can borrow a dslr and C8)

Would the RAPAS be a better solution for my needs? 
I understand it can be mounted on the MACH2 using a dovetail, with repeatable accuracy.
Is the accuracy enough for imaging and how it compares to Polemaster?

Thank you,
Andrea



--
Brian 



Brian Valente

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